Question about Stat Maxing

Question about Stat Maxing

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#21 Kittens

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15 December 2015 - 10:41 AM

Laith, on 15 December 2015 - 10:38 AM, said:

Just remember he's a boss that gives exp, in case you want to avoid some of that.

I was never really interested in Frog Drop so I left Quale to Disc 4 sidequesting.

Frog drop is pretty good, basically the same as limit glove without the tedious setup for it/risk of quina getting rekt before he gets a turn & it allows you to heal your party /w spells without ruining your damage source.
It is a pain to level up though, i'd still say zidanes thievery is the worst thing to max out..

Obviously not as useful in a lvl1 run as limit glove because of its damage formulae unless you feel up to catching 9999 frogs (dont believe thats possible because afaik frogs caught is stored /w 8bits so highest is FF = 255)

Thanks again for the exp reminder, i forgot about that.

#22 Laith

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15 December 2015 - 10:43 AM

Oh god I did hate maxing up Thievery.

About Dark Matter, yeah... It's only good for Odin and 9999 damage when used on enemies.

#23 Kittens

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15 December 2015 - 10:44 AM

Tray1990, on 15 December 2015 - 10:31 AM, said:

Abadon was the one that gave me the most trouble, I think I beat Shell Dragon on my second attempt with just attacking/healing/reviving. If I remember right, Garnet with Robe of Lords in the back row took low enough damage to to survive and healed back 900 with auto-potion/chemist so she was able to toss out some group Curagas to keep me going strong for the most part.

Unfortunantly for me my dagger has less than 900hp so i guess that confirms shes gunna die (assuming you also had protect/shell on?? & i understood that right??)

The only characters im seriously considering over-leveling for pandemonium are the casters, they're just too damn squishy

Laith, on 15 December 2015 - 10:43 AM, said:

About Dark Matter, yeah... It's only good for Odin and 9999 damage when used on enemies.

Well in that case... i think that can be my backup plan!

#24 Laith

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15 December 2015 - 10:54 AM

It's more like a last resort thing, since you only get one Dark Matter in the game. (I think, I never got to know if it was possible to get another one in some way.)

Edit: Research shows you can get two more. One stealing from Ozma and Ozma drops it after dying. So I guess you can use 2 if you manage to steal it.

#25 Kittens

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15 December 2015 - 11:01 AM

Laith, on 15 December 2015 - 10:54 AM, said:

It's more like a last resort thing, since you only get one Dark Matter in the game. (I think, I never got to know if it was possible to get another one in some way.)

You can get 3 total, my vanilla strat for ozma involves eiko throwing dark matter & zidane stealing ozma's second one because im too lazy to max thievery

Ozma also drops a third which is 100% pointless since by this point you're stronk enough to kill everything easily, except maybe that friendly yan...

Another quick question, did landon change the friendly yan in anyway for the unleashed mod?
And if he didnt is it THE hardest boss in the game still (maxed stats in vanilla) and is it killable in this mod/has anyone tried ;o

/e: You fixed your post and forums didnt update it for me ;o

#26 Tirlititi

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15 December 2015 - 11:07 AM

Kittens, on 15 December 2015 - 10:41 AM, said:

Obviously not as useful in a lvl1 run as limit glove because of its damage formulae unless you feel up to catching 9999 frogs (dont believe thats possible because afaik frogs caught is stored /w 8bits so highest is FF = 255)

I remember a discussion where it was stated that frog amount's limit was way higher. Maybe 65535. That's still useless in a lvl 1 run though.

#27 Kittens

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15 December 2015 - 11:16 AM

Tirlititi, on 15 December 2015 - 11:07 AM, said:

I remember a discussion where it was stated that frog amount's limit was way higher. Maybe 65535. That's still useless in a lvl 1 run though.

Now if this game used FFVII's damage system there'd be people farming those frogs to abuse damage overflow glitches..
(loljk they'd just kill dragons and aboose dragon crest)

65535 would be FFFF so its stored using 16bits which is an odd design choice since it stops been immediately beneficial after 101

Im guessing they did it that way either because thats how the accumulator/mathemootics works with damage calc by default or because they were worried about frog count resetting to 0 when someone caught 256 frogs which is more likely to happen than 65k frogs..

I wonder what happens if you jump rope more than 65535 times..

/e: This thread has gone super far off topic :kappa:

#28 Laith

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15 December 2015 - 11:21 AM

I wish I could answer your Yan question. I got up to Deathguise and stopped 'cause I'm still in a relatively low level and Meteor still won't be lenient and deal damage low enough to get something going on my favor.

We gotta summon Hart or Kjata. Or Tirlititi himself will surely know.

#29 Tray1990

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15 December 2015 - 11:45 AM

Kittens, on 15 December 2015 - 10:44 AM, said:

Unfortunantly for me my dagger has less than 900hp so i guess that confirms shes gunna die (assuming you also had protect/shell on?? & i understood that right??)

It's been a while though so I don't remember entirely but I actually don't think I did put protect on her, she tanked charge suprisingly well without it. I just revived her when she died and he either wasted a turn earthquaking or stomping on someone so I was able to recover Garnet to a charge survivable hp and Zidane to full before he could start damaging me again. I think that plan would have bombed if he charged like 3 times in a row but that never happened to me.

Zidane was around lvl 40ish at the time and Garnet was in the mid/upper 30s.

#30 Kittens

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15 December 2015 - 11:45 AM

Laith, on 15 December 2015 - 11:21 AM, said:

If friendly yan is un-modded its probably firmly in the "impossible" category unless he's changed how the "baaah" special works.
Base atk is 158, inflicts silence, hits entire party, its also a counter-attack so he gets even more of a dps advantage..
It also has disgustingly high native defence+evasion aswell ontop of high HP, and since theres no 9999 moves its even more difficult, throwing dead peppers at it (even after the nerf) would probably do more damage than literally anything else other than gravity attacks (cant remember if its immune to that)

Tray1990, on 15 December 2015 - 11:45 AM, said:

Zidane was around lvl 40ish at the time and Garnet was in the mid/upper 30s.

Thanks for the level estimate, if i run into a tonne of issues/ragequit it i'll level up to around 30-35 and swing at it again, my goal is basically to finish the game sub level 30 (number has been steadily increasing from 10 however..)

#31 Laith

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15 December 2015 - 11:52 AM

Given the fights, depending on your level, you might get to that level with exp from those monsters.

My Zidane is currently level 33, and that was the last time I got any exp.

#32 Kittens

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15 December 2015 - 11:58 AM

Laith, on 15 December 2015 - 11:52 AM, said:

Given the fights, depending on your level, you might get to that level with exp from those monsters.

My Zidane is currently level 33, and that was the last time I got any exp.

Right, they give exp *facedesk*
I've probably failed my lvl30 thing then unless i spread it well :c

#33 Tirlititi

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15 December 2015 - 12:28 PM

I didn't fight the Friendly Yan in my playthrough but he didn't look different (no auto-haste or anything).

Looking at his stats, he seems to have gotten quiet impossible indeed : he still has max HP, defences and a 158-powered attack. However, his strength (and magic) went from 22 to 61. So yeah, good luck :whistle:

#34 Laith

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15 December 2015 - 01:12 PM

In average, my party is definitely below 30. I just can't say how much further I can get like this. I actually stopped playing for a while because I thought the only way to get through Deathguise was to grind some levels. I still wanna try with my current party so I left it like that.

You can still shoot for finishing below 30. I know I purposefully grinded to 25, because of spellcasters' squishiness, got to master some skills as well.

#35 Hart-Hunt

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15 December 2015 - 07:20 PM

Bleh, apparently I was a little underleveled when I hit D4 Kuja / Necron, so I had to grind a bit. After I beat Necron (current version btw, which has a few changes compared to older version in case you guys didn't know), I just had lost any motivation to care about taking out Ozma (since it apparently requires an absurd level, like 70 or maybe more). Necron was the shit though, loved the whole trifecta in Unleashed.

I didn't even know the friendly Yan was the toughest enemy in the game. I always hated Yans, because of the stupid mechanic of insta-removing a character. I've never been a fan of that kind of design.

PS I lurk a lot
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#36 Laith

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16 December 2015 - 12:08 AM

Yeah, I was actually thinking I hated the Snort attack, which is pretty much the main reason I never really considered Yans to be insanely hard. I sure think they're the hardest random battle, but on my very first file I ever played, I got close to max level and well, they were puny little rams.

Except Snort still annoys me. God I hate that attack.

#37 Kittens

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16 December 2015 - 02:49 AM

Hart-Hunt, on 15 December 2015 - 07:20 PM, said:

I didn't even know the friendly Yan was the toughest enemy in the game. I always hated Yans, because of the stupid mechanic of insta-removing a character. I've never been a fan of that kind of design.

I wonder if friendly yan using snort on amarant and missing will cause return magic to rek the yan like in the kuja fight with dark..

Laith, on 15 December 2015 - 01:12 PM, said:

I think the accepted low level vanilla deathguize strat is to use autolife and eiko as a helper as her pheonix summon can save the battle if you get unluckly.
I also think its possible to prevent twister/meteor by spamming magic hammer and im 99% sure he's vulnerable to darkness so quina's night spell or soul blade /w Butterfly Edge etc should reduce the risk of normal attacks so you really only have to worry about spin.

I dont know how well that would translate over into this patch because i havent got up to this versions deathguize & the lack of 9999 moves make it a much longer battle. And something evil like reducing twisters mp cost for deathguise to 0 or raising his max mp to 999 would pretty much kill that strategy

#38 Laith

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16 December 2015 - 03:17 AM

I'm almost sure Magic Hammer isn't viable, because of increased MP.

And of course, I did try Night. He's immune to it in Unleashed.

I got through most things thanks for my experience in lvl 1 vanilla, but you realize eventually that sometimes it's just not gonna work that way. xD

I realized this kinda early in the game, but it hit me really hard in the Earth Guardian fight. Once you get there, if you didn't cross the same fate I did in my first attempt, I'll tell you about it. It was freakin' hilarious.

#39 Kittens

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16 December 2015 - 03:27 AM

Laith, on 16 December 2015 - 03:17 AM, said:

I realized this kinda early in the game, but it hit me really hard in the Earth Guardian fight. Once you get there, if you didn't cross the same fate I did in my first attempt, I'll tell you about it. It was freakin' hilarious.

Im going to go out on a limb and guess that hes immune to the mini status or absorbs air moves like twister.

Honestly my strat for him is to go into battle trance quina and attempt to cook him lel..

I'll probably be fighting him this weekend when i can justify taking the time off work to sit down and get through him + pandemonium.

Laith, on 16 December 2015 - 03:17 AM, said:

I got through most things thanks for my experience in lvl 1 vanilla, but you realize eventually that sometimes it's just not gonna work that way. xD

I'd be dissapointed honestly if i could clear it just using lvl1 playthrough strats, the first time i realised that difficulty increase was evil forest when i got destroyed by that random encounter thing that knows pollon..(dandelion??) and then vivi stayed dead for a very long time because he drew enemy attacks like a magnet..

Second time probably when i ran into an ironite and got roasted by flame trying to learn angel snack..

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