Barnacle_Ed

Character/Job Party Recommendations

518 posts in this topic

I learn the hard way that honnestly focusing on Evasion is for the most part not worth it, cause most gear that increase Evasion has low defense, and so you take a lot of damage from unavoidable attacks, one big exemple of that is Bill and Ben 1 while increasing Evasion does allow you to dodge their regular attacks, your defense get to low to survive their shadow dive.

So IMO it's better to balance a bit between defense and evasion, and Protect Up is really to important to miss.

Fenrir Knight, Death Hand, Paladin sound good to me, you could alternativly do Fenrir Knight, God Hand, Lord for Counter strat capitalizing on each Final Weapons, dedicate either God Hand or Lord as a support and the other as a fighter.

For Nightblade, Magus, Bishop you can replace Leaf Saber by equipping Tree Spirit Ring. You could also use a Wanderer, Arch Mage, Bishop party keep Mind Up with Wanderer with all his utility spells, a powerfull nuker complete with Power and Mind Down with Arch Mage complete with Bishop's sabers and support spells.

Wanderer, Paladin, Necromancer sounds good, sabers aren't a necessity as long as you have 1 or 2 to counter some bosses casting Sabers on you it should be fine. If you want Saber you could replace Hawk by Lise go Light with her and go Dark with Duran so Vanadis, Necromancer and either Duelist or Swordmaster down side is you'll have to play up to LV43 without Heal Light, it can be tough but it's doable.

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On 4/15/2020 at 7:05 AM, Nesouk said:

I learn the hard way that honnestly focusing on Evasion is for the most part not worth it, cause most gear that increase Evasion has low defense, and so you take a lot of damage from unavoidable attacks, one big exemple of that is Bill and Ben 1 while increasing Evasion does allow you to dodge their regular attacks, your defense get to low to survive their shadow dive.

You're right. Only way I see with a Hawk, Angela Kevin party is by going with Nightblade, Grand Divina and Dervish. Dervish needs to always have the Invert armor to get def up, you will have no other option in terms of armor for him. But then you will lack mind up or a way to boost angela's power I guess you could stack on sahagins scales at least on important fights, while using her final weapon you could use her spells to boost magic damage too by casting them as sabers, Hawk debuffs. Kevin does also have some nice sabers, his final weapon might be a no go tho with a team like this. Which would be fine I guess.

On 4/15/2020 at 7:05 AM, Nesouk said:

Fenrir Knight, Death Hand, Paladin sound good to me, you could alternativly do Fenrir Knight, God Hand, Lord for Counter strat capitalizing on each Final Weapons, dedicate either God Hand or Lord as a support and the other as a fighter

Hmm do you think the fireblaze strategy is enough fot mobs that are tough to beat with a physical heavy party and no antimagic? Well on the other hand Lise has her summon too, might make more use of that for mobs. This is a great team, the 3 of them with their final weapons help greatly one other. The playthrough I just finished was similar (Lord, Dragonmaster, Bishop), similar in the sense it used Lord's final weapon to their advantage for counter.

That team is going to have a tough time on Fiegmund and Xan Bie om the other hand. For Xan Bie I cannjust stack in sabers and ice coincs if I can afford. It might be a good idea to farm a demon claw or two for fiegmund from those magic seeds.

On 4/15/2020 at 7:05 AM, Nesouk said:

For Nightblade, Magus, Bishop you can replace Leaf Saber by equipping Tree Spirit Ring. You could also use a Wanderer, Arch Mage, Bishop party keep Mind Up with Wanderer with all his utility spells, a powerfull nuker complete with Power and Mind Down with Arch Mage complete with Bishop's sabers and support spells.

Another fantastic team as well. I will probably use one for Hawk as a main, other with Angela or Carlie as a main.

 

On 4/15/2020 at 7:05 AM, Nesouk said:

Wanderer, Paladin, Necromancer sounds good, sabers aren't a necessity as long as you have 1 or 2 to counter some bosses casting Sabers on you it should be fine. If you want Saber you could replace Hawk by Lise go Light with her and go Dark with Duran so Vanadis, Necromancer and either Duelist or Swordmaster down side is you'll have to play up to LV43 without Heal Light, it can be tough but it's doable.

 

I might do Vanadis, Duelist, Necromancer another time, since I just finished a Duran, Lise, Carlie playthrough wanna play a bit with other characters. Wanted to try it before on Duran's path but scrapped it, will probably pick Lise as a main with that team. Duelist LV3 tech power is going to be pretty insane with that set up I imagine.

 

So many teams to try out. Now seems like the time to do them, being stuck at home haha.

Edited by smileless

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I think I am gonna be bold and pick Fenrir Knight, Lord, God Hand next, Lamian Naga being the only damaging spell not sure how this will go.

Gotta take my time with that. Then I will run the Fenrir Knight/Paladin/Death Hand for another time and then compare the two.

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I understand Kevin is nowhere near as powerful as he is in the vanilla game but is he still the best physical attacker by a significant margin?

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Ok I just beat the Archdemon with Fenrir Knight, God Hand, Lord. The team worked much better than I thought it would but you really gotta stack on coins for few fights like Fiegmund and Xan Bie. And Bigieu even on Normal it's so tough. 

And I had to fight Jagan twice, game froze once after I beat him after I casted a spell on a mob. 

 

Spoiler

Black Rabite honestly just the reflect armor so he kills himself. Backtrack to buy Angels Grails that you will definitely spent here.

Spoiler

Archdemon was difficult in the sense that you had to keep up with him, he casted Dragon's Eye like 3 times, 1 on his first phase 2 on his 2nd phase.

The final weapons of the three just worked beautifully here. Due to Archdemon casting spells more often you could easily land counters here, no time wasted. Buffs/debuffs, fireblaze strat, and Lord with his final weapon was doing a whooping 800 damage on this fucker.

Kevin had to single cast Counter Magic but it's ok.

Now onto the Kevin's route. Might try a Kevin, Lise, Angela pick. I think Dervish, Vanadis, Archmage sounds pretty good.

Kevin with his strongest wolf form and some sabers, Vanadis with buffs and heals, Archmage with antimagic, mind down, power down, nukes enemies.

Edited by smileless

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31 minutes ago, smileless said:
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Buffs/debuffs, fireblaze strat, and Lord with his final weapon was doing a whooping 800 damage on this fucker.

 

Spoiler

Yeah, definitly should nerf that weapon.
The MAIN effect is triggering counterframes, the increased damage was just supposed to be a small extra.

 

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8 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:
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Yeah, definitly should nerf that weapon.
The MAIN effect is triggering counterframes, the increased damage was just supposed to be a small extra.

 

Spoiler

Yeah I agree, I think it should be nerfed slightly. At least to 600-650 in such a scenario might be good enough. Stronger than Paladin's/Swordmasters lv3 tech but weaker than Duelist and Death Hand lv3 techs.

 

Edited by smileless

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Currently will be running a Dervish, Vanadis, Archmage party think I am decided on that now. Thinking on how I should build Dervish, I guess his stronger wolf form might have stronger lv3 tech too but weaker than Death Hand's?

Future:

Ninja Master or Nightblade, Vanadise, Duelist - need more thinking, might pick Nightblade but Ninja Master might work even better with MT Jutsu's, sabers. Might lean more towards NinjaMaster, Vanadise already has to sacrifice a ring slot for whiteline ring.

Or: Rogue, Vanadise, Archmage or Evil Shaman

Death Hand, Vanadise, Necromancer - this one should be fun, one of those times where it's time to bring out Death Hand's final weapon.

Paladin, Rune Master, Necromancer - it lacks Mind Up to boost Angela's damage but the sabers still do a fine job, 6 different sabers, Magic Shield, Black Course, Black Rain, Half Vanish, status infliction spells. This should be another fun one to try.  No speed up but might not be a real big deal, use Duran to draw enemies to him while Angela and Carlie do their spell casting.

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On 4/21/2020 at 6:14 AM, smileless said:

Paladin, Rune Master, Necromancer - it lacks Mind Up to boost Angela's damage but the sabers still do a fine job, 6 different sabers, Magic Shield, Black Course, Black Rain, Half Vanish, status infliction spells. This should be another fun one to try.  No speed up but might not be a real big deal, use Duran to draw enemies to him while Angela and Carlie do their spell casting.

Just an idea: Based on tests I did with my previous team, Rune Master should be able "charge" Paladin wearing reflect armor and the appropriate shield with a level 3 status spell off-screen, Stone Cloud for instance, after which he can heal up and enter the next screen. Then, any enemy attacking Paladin will have Petrify reflected back onto them until Paladin is hit with new spell, even after entering new screens. I was able to do this with Sleep Flower, but Stone Cloud or Cold Blaze would be even better.

 

On 4/21/2020 at 6:14 AM, smileless said:

Currently will be running a Dervish, Vanadis, Archmage party think I am decided on that now. Thinking on how I should build Dervish, I guess his stronger wolf form might have stronger lv3 tech too but weaker than Death Hand's?

The Dervish has changed a bit in 1.2 and now has Antimagic, but no Dark Saber. If you're planning to use the new update, I'd suggest reviewing the classes again since some of the skills have changed.

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To commemorate the new update, I'm starting a new leafy moony "Flower Power" group of Wanderer, Fenrir Knight, and Grand Divina. I'm also trying to think of a killer team for the new Death Hand with his crazy physical/magical defense rasping final weapon, Magic Shield, and sharable Aura Wave. Please list any ideas!

Edited by rpschamp

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37 minutes ago, rpschamp said:

The Dervish has changed a bit in 1.2 and now has Antimagic, but no Dark Saber. If you're planning to use the new update, I'd suggest reviewing the classes again since some of the skills have changed.

 

Yeah I saw it, decided to go with Death Hand instead.

 

38 minutes ago, rpschamp said:

Just an idea: Based on tests I did with my previous team, Rune Master should be able "charge" Paladin wearing reflect armor and the appropriate shield with a level 3 status spell off-screen, Stone Cloud for instance, after which he can heal up and enter the next screen. Then, any enemy attacking Paladin will have Petrify reflected back onto them until Paladin is hit with new spell, even after entering new screens. I was able to do this with Sleep Flower, but Stone Cloud or Cold Blaze would be even better.

Sounds like a viable strat, I like it. It's something I haven't done before also, so I will give it a try.

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On 25/04/2020 at 5:42 PM, rpschamp said:

To commemorate the new update, I'm starting a new leafy moony "Flower Power" group of Wanderer, Fenrir Knight, and Grand Divina. I'm also trying to think of a killer team for the new Death Hand with his crazy physical/magical defense rasping final weapon, Magic Shield, and sharable Aura Wave. Please list any ideas!

 

I think Death Hand, DragonMaster, Sage might be a great one. Empowered antimagic, curse upgrade, Kevin helps Sage's healing with Magic Shield and his Magic shield could replace def up which this party would lack, and his final weapon helps Carlie's spell power. Make full use of Dark Saber and Dark Force with Empowered Antimagic and Curse Upgrade.

Edited by smileless

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On 25/04/2020 at 5:42 PM, rpschamp said:

To commemorate the new update, I'm starting a new leafy moony "Flower Power" group of Wanderer, Fenrir Knight, and Grand Divina. I'm also trying to think of a killer team for the new Death Hand with his crazy physical/magical defense rasping final weapon, Magic Shield, and sharable Aura Wave. Please list any ideas!

I'm currently gonna play Death Hand, Dark Hawk (not sure which one) and Gran Divina. I theorize however a solid team would be Death Hand, Bishop, Dark Hawk Bishop now having Power Up you get all buff except offensive Mind Up, all the 6 main Sabers, all debuffs both Kevin and Hawk are solid damage dealer, not sure which Hawk Ninja Master is Ninja Master, now that he has Silver Dart Nightblade can exploit the 6 main element. Only thing missing is Anti-Magic might need to get consumable on some fight like Xian Bhe.

Or Death Hand, Bishop, Arch Mage could work to trading Speed Down and Protect Down for Anti Magic and a powerfull caster.

Other ideas with Death Hand :

-Death Hand, Lord, Fenrir Knight : Fenrir Knight now has Leaf Saber for MP management, now Counter allow to bypass physical resistance and immunity so Lord being able to open Counter will allow to damage even ennemies that resist physical so this is great especially with Fenrir Knight being able to Heal through Counter, you're still missing Power Up sadly.

-Death Hand, Dark Carlie, Gran Divina : More magic oriented miss Mind Up but eventually get all Sabers and with Death Hand's final weapon get an alternative way to reduce Magic Defense, speed up, with Necromancer it get Black Curse, powerfull spells and Half Vanish, with Evil Shaman you get Antimagic and more utility spells overall.

-Death Hand, Ninja Master, Lord : Get both Energy Ball and Detect for Crit Build (now that there is new weapons for it), Lord and Ninja Master can open counter for physical resistant ennemies, Death Hand can power up Lord's Heal Light

Personnaly on Kevin's side I liked to also give a shot at Warrior Monk now that he is quite a unique class, since it is the only class in the game to naturally have Heal Light and being able to debuff (missing only Protect Down).

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Now with the Leaf Coat Spell Upgrade, I think some nice teams could come out of that. 

"Next fire elemental spell or lv2/3 tech deals increased damage"

Rogue, Wanderer, Nightblade, Magus, Dervish could make some use of the Earth Bracelet. DragonMaster + Rogue might turn out to be a nice combo, with Rogue making use of all these spell upgrades.

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Thinking of parties with Warrior Monk in them:

Warrior Monk, Wanderer, Rune Master

Debuffs, heal, Magic Shield, Anti-Magic, 5 sabers that might work as replacement for Mind Up, Half Vanish.

Or replace Rune Master with Grand Diviba and get Speed Up, Transshape + 6 additional sabers. Magus might work too, no sabers but she gets her own Mind Up, Death Spell.

Warrior Monk, Swordmaster, Vanadise - heal, debuffs, Lise is free from her role as a healer and on bosses she could make use of her final weapon by using any element. Duran with that crit build. Might troublesome on mobs tho you will lose a lot of exp with Lise's summon, and no anti-magic, might want to rely on counters to take some of them out.

You could choose instead of Vanadise Wanderer for Magic Shield, Anti-Magic, Half Vanish.

Edited by smileless

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I think one good class to pair with Warrior Monk is Star Lancer, these 2 get all buffs, all debuff except Protect Down, Energy Ball and Detect as well as Aura Wave which sync well with Warrior Monk's Final Weapon (also if you run crit build and use the weapon that increase Crit Rate with TP) and good old Marduke.

With this 2 you techncally can with anyone IMO.

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Yeah you're right. I think I will try a Warrior Monk based party next. For now I think I will start Death Hand, DragonMaster, Sage, this one should be fun.

Edited by smileless

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On 4/29/2020 at 5:09 AM, smileless said:

Yeah you're right. I think I will try a Warrior Monk based party next. For now I think I will start Death Hand, DragonMaster, Sage, this one should be fun.

Here's an alternative that takes advantage of a base resistance/elemental saber strategy:

Wanderer/Rogue, Warrior Monk, Necromancer

Every character here has a base resistance against Dark, and Necromancer has Dark Saber; cast Dark Saber on enemies and melee/tech damage goes down up to 45% for all characters without needing any resistance equipment. I tried this with my Wanderer, Grand Divina, Necromancer team, with Mananan Robe on Grand Divina; it worked wonders against werewolves, knights, and the like; Lugar was a joke. With Wanderer, this team gets all debuffs, all buffs except for the offensive half of Mind Up and Speed Up, two double-hitters with Power Up, Energy Ball/Analyze for critical hits, Heal Light, Tinkle Rain, Aura Wave, Antimagic, and Leaf Saber to support two casters. With Rogue, you sacrifice Aura Wave, Antimagic, and Energy Ball, but pick up a better offensive caster and all buffs by inverting Necromancer.

The missing thing with this team is the basic elemental sabers, but with heavy damage already coming from two double-hitters and Necromancer, you should be fine just collecting/buying them for boss fights or going with elemental accessories instead.

EDIT: Actually, I may run this team instead of the Wanderer, Fenrir Knight, Grand Divina team I mentioned above since I haven't started that game yet. I've run Grand Divina in pretty much every team I've used recently, and I'm always looking to replace Lise, so this might give me some new perspective.

Edited by rpschamp

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Another thing to mention: The new Beastman Collar now gives access to an instant Heal Light at the second class change. Should be great for Light Kevin!

(I always thought Heal Light should be upgradable to Sudden....) 

Edited by rpschamp

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That is not an upgrade but a tradeoff!
You sacrifice a use of a tech to get spell X out ASAP.

Might be useful with the 3xTP = crit rate weapon to hold unto the insta cast for when you need it and until then enjoy the extra crits to compensate for the lack of techs or something.

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20 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

That is not an upgrade but a tradeoff!
You sacrifice a use of a tech to get spell X out ASAP.

Might be useful with the 3xTP = crit rate weapon to hold unto the insta cast for when you need it and until then enjoy the extra crits to compensate for the lack of techs or something.

I didn't say Beastman Collar was an upgrade. It should still be great for Light Kevin since he accumulates tech points faster with his double hit, also with Warrior Monk's final weapon in addition to the weapon you mentioned. As far as I can see, Beastman Collar is the only way to cast an instant Heal Light, but he needs to tech up before he can do it again. Of course, plenty of other casters can cast Heal Light reasonably quickly by the second half of the game, so I'm not sure it matters too much, but it may enable a low Intelligence build for Kevin.

I did say that I thought Heal Light should be "upgradable" to Sudden, but this was just to keep the terms straight, since Sudden is listed in the skills file under "Possible Upgrades". Although with Sage Stone, this would also obviously be a tradeoff :-)

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