praetarius5018

Final Fantasy V: Void Divergence - Discussion

339 posts in this topic

yep, i have !x-fight unlocked through ranger! i tried using !X-fight as a command with both the Gale Bow and the Elven Bow and both functioned as expected. i only encountered this issue when !Fight-ing with the Gale Bow. 75% of the time, the Gale Bow is just fine, which is why it took me a second to realize what was causing the hangup.

out of curiosity, i looked to see if any of the other weapons which procced job actions were working with !Fight. haven't made it to the phantom village for the thief knife yet, but Dancing Dagger was able to proc !Dance just fine. Sword Dance and Jitterbug Duet landed as expected in my test as well.

Edited by windydude

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So just to be clear any boss can be afflicted with any status ailment now if you try hard enough and mess around with the element board? Also i am horrible at the game probably but i always die any more from the sap caused by the element bored and i dont know how to remove it after makeing the board in my faver...pure doesnt work on that verson of sap so i dont know what to do to prevent it

Edited by verninater

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hey verninater: i'm not sure if it's Any Boss with Any Status Ailment, but the majority of enemies and bosses are vulnerable to most elements. i believe polymorph effects like Toad and Tiny don't work on certain bosses, but deal damage instead. if the element of the status effect is the same as the element of the enemy (like try to use Break on an Earth enemy), then that enemy has either a resistance or an immunity-- i haven't tried to test out which it is, but they've never worked for me.

i don't believe that you can stop the damage over time caused by the field effects. if you set up a field to have damage over time effects, the cost is that your party will also be affected by it. i know some bosses have abilities which set the field with a particular dangerous combo effect. if you're struggling with field effects, make sure you're using !Brave for extra to set up the field elements that way you want it. you can also use the Sage's !Meta to use Intense on spells, which causes them to drop two icons instead of one. a mage with !Brv, !Meta, and spells (like !Black or !Summon) can set up a full field with favorable elements, or help recover from the boss's field sabotage, in a single turn.

hope that helps!

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On 30.10.2020 at 9:21 AM, windydude said:

out of curiosity, i looked to see if any of the other weapons which procced job actions were working with !Fight. haven't made it to the phantom village for the thief knife yet, but Dancing Dagger was able to proc !Dance just fine. Sword Dance and Jitterbug Duet landed as expected in my test as well.

ok so that more or less proves my suspicion, only x-fight and twincut use the variable. and the later is on no weapon.

12 hours ago, verninater said:

So just to be clear any boss can be afflicted with any status ailment now if you try hard enough and mess around with the element board?

technically yes, but elementally resisted status effects require a ton of effort and high magic stat so it is most likely never worth bothering. status effects work less on rng now and more on a status damage variant. if your magic is too weak and they resist the status the damage may be in fact 0 making it impossible.

12 hours ago, verninater said:

Also i am horrible at the game probably but i always die any more from the sap caused by the element bored and i dont know how to remove it after makeing the board in my faver...pure doesnt work on that verson of sap so i dont know what to do to prevent it

if you mean the sap from:
2 water + 2 earth = 4 poison, set swamp effect
try praising the sun:
2 fire + 2 light = 4 sun, removes swamp effect, dot vs undead units, heal user if consumed

also the dot from swamp is poison element so units weak to poison take much more damage from it.

if instead you mean the sap from:
2 wind + 2 void = 4 vacuum, massive dot
get the icons ASAP out of the field. that one is basically "you die" level of damage

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Ah...im stuck on the lady that absorbs elements in the void world...cant remember her name as im on a hiatus...but vaccum came up alot..thanks for the tip

Edited by verninater

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I assume you mean Merugene?

This version is a bit stricter on the element gimmick than vanilla's where you could just bruteforce it with physical.
But in comparison she always uses a spell of her current "type" after form change instead of fight/wait for 1-2 rounds where you could only blindly guess in vanilla.
Her forms are fire, ice, bolt and wind - the last replacing a non-elemental high p.def form - each form has one unlisted weakness out of the same elements.
E.g. if she form changes and then casts ice she is weak to fire.

Same as vanilla she always starts with the form weak to fire.
Technically you can bypass the entire gimmick with the pierce passive but she takes 3x damage from her proper weakness so it'd still be worth it to play along.

On 30.10.2020 at 5:58 AM, windydude said:

the arcanist, in particular, has a bunch of very specific abilities that seem powerful, but i'm not much of an arithmetician myself so i'm having trouble cracking any "broken" uses. if anyone's got any tricks or tips for using the arcanist, i'd love to hear them :`) 

!Scan is your friend for L3/4, Odd/Even, Crusher and XXXX.
If the weaknesses line up, cast the damage+status spells and then follow up with GrimWail.
For ChainBolt you want 5+ enemies at the same time.

Edited by praetarius5018

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I know it's been a few months since the last post in this topic but i'm looking for some help involving single mode. Vampire seems like a fun class to use but keeping them alive in the early game is quite difficult. Any good classes that can help support that? I feel like absorb would be better at sustaining them if it didn't split. Any tips with vampire in general would be nice, but i am trying single mode so if anyone's tried this without a team of 4 vampires i'd like to hear ideas.

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Vampire is difficult them being undead and all.
I assume you already use Skeleton to have a "mini golem" guard.

I'd try some of these:

  • TimeMage for HP regen and their usual CC
  • Lord with Insurance to endure death and healing via Judge (expensive early on)
  • Magus for LifeMark after 480 kills (apply on monster, kill it, get healed)
  • RedMage with Depower to reduce both STR&MAG
  • BlueMage BigGuard and Whitewind would cover most problems but comes super late
  • Chemist with GiantMix and Protect for HP+50%, armor and shell
  • Crusader with Shout (mag down) and Growth (HP up)

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6 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

Vampire is difficult them being undead and all.
I assume you already use Skeleton to have a "mini golem" guard.

I'd try some of these:

  • TimeMage for HP regen and their usual CC
  • Lord with Insurance to endure death and healing via Judge (expensive early on)
  • Magus for LifeMark after 480 kills (apply on monster, kill it, get healed)
  • RedMage with Depower to reduce both STR&MAG
  • BlueMage BigGuard and Whitewind would cover most problems but comes super late
  • Chemist with GiantMix and Protect for HP+50%, armor and shell
  • Crusader with Shout (mag down) and Growth (HP up)

Thanks! I'd tried chemist but the cooldown's kind of intense. But a lot of this is super helpful!

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v1.656

  • replaced gauge option with alternate job sprites option (sprites provided by zetawilk)
  • HP display now also updates on damage pop up instead of after the whole round ends
  • no longer hides field icons on victory
  • battle UI now displays status health bar between HP and atb bar; toggle status bar on/off with select
  • battle UI displays stun/stop/singing duration instead of atb ticks, bar becomes then colored pink
  • added bonus to first turn speed for fastest party member if a faster enemy exists (i.e. should go first in all boss fights)
  • HP regen now also gives healing over time like inverse HP leak (negated by HP leak); reduced strength of the periodic big heal
  • each hero can now only endure (defend, endure passive, insurance, heavy status) fatal damage once per battle
  • monster that perform reactions to specific attacks can now do so only once per turn
  • split cooldowns into item and skill types
  • cooldown for skills is affected by strength
  • using brave recovers half a turn of skill cooldown (def. recovers 25% of remaining item cooldown)
  • using weapon spells (e.g. defense sword or rod breaking) now adds 5 turns of item cooldown
  • enemy HP and AGL is now scaled by number of present party members
  • returning enemies in world 3 that are below rank 28 are increased to 28
  • changed player weight penalty on ATB to be more percentage instead of flat
  • adjusted item cooldowns
  • corpses can no longer aegis block attacks
  • set known spell levels by default to max for menu and confuse purposes
  • reduced scaling of monster damage by about 20%
  • reduced influence of MAG for monster status chance to 1/4 the previous value
  • changed element typing of karlabos, siren(undead), galura and crayclaw
  • changed AI of siren; mostly guaranteed haste at 50% instead of random
  • changed Atomos AI; phase 1 nerfed, added a phase 2
  • changed Exdeath (solo vs Galuf) AI a bit to show more of his regular skills
  • changed Exdeath (castle) AI
  • changed arcanist skills; themed around producing combo, empty and broken field icons
  • empty field icons oppose all elements but have no further special effects
  • broken field icons can't be removed, oppose all elements and reduce healing spell power by 25% each multiplicatively
  • reduced bonus HP from HP job levels from (20+total job levels, max 50) to (20+total job levels, max 35)
  • WhiteMage learns !Mantra instead of !Recover
  • passives that gave +10% HP now give +20%
  • heal amp is no longer innate
  • medicine also increases heal spells by 20%
  • barrier no longer displays an animation; needed to fix a bug that treats the animation as a real action (cost 100 mp for a <nothing> extra action)
  • !aim also doubles crit rate and has increased power of 115
  • !skill/examine now costs 0 mp to use and is always available
  • changed !mantra to a 140 power aoe heal, 170 if unarmed, based on vit/mag
  • increased Bushido/Booster's power from 35 to 55
  • increased Skill/Treat's power from 45 to 60 and cost from 10 to 15
  • increased Predict/Blessing's power from 193 to 216 and changed it to also cure toad, mini, zombie and petrify
  • changed Blue/Exploder damage bonus for player from x2 to ~1% per MAG (+100% at 99)
  • two handed only weapons now gain damage bonus from power grip
  • use better of both equipped weapons for crit rate bonus instead of sum
  • increased crit bonus of knives and whips a bit
  • changed thief glove from 2x steal chance to +10% steal chance and 4x rare steal chance
  • replaced fire bow with battle bow and moved it to walse
  • made soot, shuriken an fuuma shuriken usable as exotic weapons
  • added effect to soot when used with !fight to prevent the target's next field icon
  • changed kunai from weapon block to a long range throwing knife
  • moved judgement staff from DarkMage to MindMage and DoomDealer
  • changed bomb damage scaling; now scales with stacksize, AGL, level and medicine passive
  • removed miss chance from bombs
  • nerfed ribbons from +5 all stats to +3
  • random hit skills like comet and meteor have been reduced from max 5 hits to 4
  • physical techs now apply power grip and backrow compatibility by equipped weapon
  • physical techs that display the equipped weapon when attacking now properly use both when dual wielding
  • berserk should now no longer skip the first action
  • increased brawl increase to m.atk if unarmed by +50%+10
  • changed release skills to not profit from user's m.atk bonuses, only passives
  • changed physical release skills to properly use the monster's element
  • reduced base damage scaling of release skills
  • blitz/pummel and rush are now affected by row
  • drag-on breath skills are now str/mag based
  • tinker turret and herobot are now agl/mag based
  • esemte recover is now level based
  • removed stats&ailment checks from flee chance
  • Krile should now start with same job and abilities active as Galuf
  • Minotaur now requires mp to cast holy
  • can no longer stack evade chance of the two parry type weapons (guardian vs hardened dagger)
  • mini status now gives +20 evade instead of 2x, capped at 70 instead of 99
  • mute status no longer has a limited duration
  • doom status can no longer kill bosses (bypasses death scripts), only reduce them down to 1 HP and 0 LP at most
  • heavy status reduces applicable status duration now only by 25% instead of 50%
  • added exceptions to the skill "targeting" to avoid Omega's barrier getting transferred to the player
  • fixed exdeath and leviatan battle name display; formerly showed empty space instead of box border to the right of the name
  • fixed geomancer learning !animals instead of cqc
  • fixed ManKill not counting as knife for proficiency
  • fixed dragon lance not getting doublegrip bonus despite saying it does
  • fixed GaleBow's X-Fight crashing the game
  • fixed a bug with dual wielding that treats the second weapon as having 0 attack
  • fixed a bug that gave released monster full damage multiplier on percentage moves
  • fixed a bug that overrode caught monster when receiving a status effect
  • fixed animation on condemn playing when not inflicting the status effect
  • fixed name of vacuum blade special
  • fixed that physical techs were affected by Lich passive and fork tower
  • fixed phoenix spell animation
  • fixed bug that taught oath/genome spells already when depleting the first LP instead of the last
  • inflicting stun and old with the same attack no longer results in perma stun
Edited by praetarius5018

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v1.658

  • fixed mix/restore and red/purge not being able to target a petrified unit
  • fixed issues in the formula for rare steal chance
  • if a target has no rare steal, rare steal chance now becomes 0%

also tried to write status damage in the mechanics folder, read at your own risk

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On 9/14/2019 at 9:57 AM, praetarius5018 said:

well, you can defend, equip relics with poison element resistance, put fire element icons on the field, etc. to lower poison status chance and then cast pure before too much status damage piles up and the chance gets up to 100% anyway.

I know this is old but I just ran into this fight doing a fresh expert run. There is only one poison relic in a chest up to that point. There's no heal and no relics. At this point, it's just pure grind and pray she dies first. Unless you curse yourself and sage or force someone to do monk mantra. Kinda defeats the purpose of the mod a bit though... Shrug. Pretty sure it's not possible without one of those short of 8hrs of grinding.

Edited by Hordequester

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On 22.12.2021 at 1:30 AM, Hordequester said:

I know this is old but I just ran into this fight doing a fresh expert run. There is only one poison relic in a chest up to that point. There's no heal and no relics. At this point, it's just pure grind and pray she dies first. Unless you curse yourself and sage or force someone to do monk mantra. Kinda defeats the purpose of the mod a bit though... Shrug. Pretty sure it's not possible without one of those short of 8hrs of grinding.

To resist poison you can use either poison or fire relics.

Sage stone can be unequipped; the penalty only triggers if you have an "illegal" state right now - if you unlock the job proper or just switch job back before you learn anything from it you are good to go.

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On a new run for the new year and seeing this update still is always good to see.

A few questions though:

With Sap Mark, the spreadsheet mentions give/take 20% less damage, does that mean the target but takes less and does more damage? Or is it that enemies would do less if targeted and party members would take less if targeted?

Also, Yin-Yang seems strong, but the spreadsheet descriptions don't quite accurately inform me of how the power varies. It just says it varies. Do the damaging spells do more if i lean towards one side? Do i need to interchange them to keep balance to do more damage? How exactly does that work?

Freedom says it gives resistance to Stop, would that work if the target is stopped already?

And lastly, does M-Cannon just not work on heavy targets? I was a bit curious to know what "Auto-breaks" meant exactly.

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3 hours ago, booman77 said:

With Sap Mark, the spreadsheet mentions give/take 20% less damage, does that mean the target but takes less and does more damage? Or is it that enemies would do less if targeted and party members would take less if targeted?

Imagine that a monster would normally do 1000 damage to you and you 2000 to them with a given attack.
If you cast Sap Mark on that monster it now does only 800 damage and takes 1600.
Same if instead you had cast the mark on your character.
If you have it active on both the damage becomes 640 and 1280.

3 hours ago, booman77 said:

Also, Yin-Yang seems strong, but the spreadsheet descriptions don't quite accurately inform me of how the power varies. It just says it varies. Do the damaging spells do more if i lean towards one side? Do i need to interchange them to keep balance to do more damage? How exactly does that work?

Each player has their own yin-yang balance which at the start of the battle is neutral (+0).
For each target that a yin spell hits it gives a +1, each target of a yang spell is -1, at most +/-10.
Yang/paradox multiplies it by -1.
Yin spells get weaker the higher this value is; at +0 they have 100%, at -10 135%, at +10 15%.
Opposite for yang. So yes, alternate them.

You could also tank your score by doing an aoe yin spell first and then enjoy multiple turns of strengthened single target yang spells.

3 hours ago, booman77 said:

Freedom says it gives resistance to Stop, would that work if the target is stopped already?

No, it gives the same resistance as if the correct status resist relic was equipped, so it only lowers the stop status build-up.

3 hours ago, booman77 said:

And lastly, does M-Cannon just not work on heavy targets? I was a bit curious to know what "Auto-breaks" meant exactly.

Normally M-Cannon "empties" a field icon per target on use, e.g. 5x fire becomes 4x fire + 1x empty.
Or if all 5 are already empty 1 icon instead becomes a broken icon.
However if the target is heavy instead of empty the icon becomes immediatly broken, so 5x fire would become 4x fire + 1x broken.

Empty icons get just moved along like all other icons and can be refilled eventually.
Broken icons are unmovable and stay until the end of battle.
Both of those oppose all elements, same way a light icon reduces fire damage.
However broken icons additionally hurt the power of your heal spells.

Those broken icons can be good or bad depending on how active you manage the icons; e.g. if you rely on summons this is very bad since those get a much stronger effect from matching icons.
If you tend to lose control of what goes on with the icons you can produce 2 broken icons and then not worry about bosses producing detrimental field combos.

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Hello! I made an account because I just wanted to say that this is one of the most fun, creative, and overall impressive hacks I've ever played. I just got the Fire Crystal jobs, and I've been playing on difficulty 2 Normal mode, so here're my thoughts so far, mostly on some kf the classes. (I haven't tried every job I have yet, but I've planned things out so I get to use every job at least a little)

 

Black Mage seems stupid good. It's dealing way more damage than basically anything else, partly thanks to the comparitively large amount of elements it has access to early game. The only other job I've seen come close is a Monk's Blitz moves, and some of those are only single target. Physical jobs just aren't keeping up and its fragility is mostly solved by 4th position + backrow, and will likely become less of an issue as I level classes with Vit/HP levels.

 

It's been a while since I've played vanilla FF5, but was stealing always this hard? Even as a Thief it felt like my steal attempts failed more than half the time. Pillage is a bit busted though, it feels like I've gotten several thousand gold more in equipment than I 'should' have the last couple dungeons.

 

Even with all that gold, I'm finding it hard to get Bombs for Tinker abilities. New equipment and magic still takes up most of my income and unloke most other items it seems like I've barely found any from chests/enemies. Tinker is still fine as a class because it has X-Item which has been a godsend but I'd like to play around with its abilities a bit more.

 

Also, idk if it's what you intended but I've been using the basic Skills a lot even now just because of Aid. Essentially giving one character's turn to another is amazing in a lot of situations, if only to maximize the damage my main attacker(s) are putting out.

 

Most random encounters so far seem pretty tame. I haven't had many 'oh ****' moments from them, and the way this gane works means that they're not draining my resources in any meaningful way. They mostly go down in a few aoe attacks, or occasionally a Masscast-boosted status spell.

 

Boss fights have been great though. Siren especially was incredibly intense, since I was using a Sage Stone Vampire to learn the Oath attack so I couldn't use any of the aoe healing options I had at the moment. I basically had to cast Skeleton intermittantly to ensure that physical attacks didn't wreck me, and then blast away as quickly as possible before she overwhelmed me with damage. It was a really engaging fight that got my brain muscles really moving, although I have no idea how I'd have done it on difficulty 1 lmao.

 

So yeah, this hack has been great so far, and I look forward to playing more of it. I'll probably post a more as I get further into the game. Thanks for taking the time to make this!

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6 hours ago, borker223 said:

Black Mage seems stupid good. It's dealing way more damage than basically anything else, partly thanks to the comparitively large amount of elements it has access to early game. The only other job I've seen come close is a Monk's Blitz moves, and some of those are only single target. Physical jobs just aren't keeping up and its fragility is mostly solved by 4th position + backrow, and will likely become less of an issue as I level classes with Vit/HP levels.

As usual when this comes up, how big is the difference? Magic doesn't get crits but I try to compensate that by adjusting the damage by an theoretical average (crit rate x dmg%). Weapons are affected by their element, physical skills take the equipped weapon's element, do you match them to the target's weakness the same you choose fire/ice/bolt? On aoe skills, magic deals less per target, physical aoes have a fixed multiplier, against how many targets are you comparing?

6 hours ago, borker223 said:

It's been a while since I've played vanilla FF5, but was stealing always this hard? Even as a Thief it felt like my steal attempts failed more than half the time. Pillage is a bit busted though, it feels like I've gotten several thousand gold more in equipment than I 'should' have the last couple dungeons.

Vanilla steal chance was 40%, 80% with the thief gloves. Here it is.
40 base
+(agl-24) if agl > 24
cap at 90 if above, then:
+10 if thief job
+10 if thief gloves equipped

Not sure what else I should've done with Pillage, it was mostly meant for the "unique" things certain bosses carry. If it was only a 50% chance for 2x items that would just be a disgusting reset-fest for those items that are already rare steals...

6 hours ago, borker223 said:

Even with all that gold, I'm finding it hard to get Bombs for Tinker abilities. New equipment and magic still takes up most of my income and unloke most other items it seems like I've barely found any from chests/enemies. Tinker is still fine as a class because it has X-Item which has been a godsend but I'd like to play around with its abilities a bit more.

I intend the gold management to be similar to the limitation of job levels. You can't get all class level in one playthrough, in the same vein you should make an informed choice of how to use gold, does your current playthrough need bombs, can you get by without them? Bombs primarily are meant as a crutch to make the 6 bomb boss possible for every single party comb in single job mode, everything beyond that is a bonus. Admittedly, if you can get a lot of bombs early in W1 they are a minor game breaker.

6 hours ago, borker223 said:

Also, idk if it's what you intended but I've been using the basic Skills a lot even now just because of Aid. Essentially giving one character's turn to another is amazing in a lot of situations, if only to maximize the damage my main attacker(s) are putting out.

Same as bomb, it gives me a baseline of guaranteed abilities every party composition has (especially for single job mode). I know that you always have a heal spell, a magic attack, an accuracy buff, the option to see weaknesses/stats and a way to manipulate MP. That means I have to hold back less when designing bosses. For regular play, the specialized job skills should take center stage.

6 hours ago, borker223 said:

Most random encounters so far seem pretty tame. I haven't had many 'oh ****' moments from them, and the way this gane works means that they're not draining my resources in any meaningful way. They mostly go down in a few aoe attacks, or occasionally a Masscast-boosted status spell.

We have 40+ bosses, randoms don't need to be impactful, I just see them as "resources" in this hack, be it gold, items, blue spells, beastmaster ammo, etc. That's why you can just switch them off.

Focus is simply on bosses on multiple playthroughs. If random fights were actual show stoppers, most people would probably lose interest before even reaching W3.

6 hours ago, borker223 said:

Boss fights have been great though. Siren especially was incredibly intense, since I was using a Sage Stone Vampire to learn the Oath attack so I couldn't use any of the aoe healing options I had at the moment. I basically had to cast Skeleton intermittantly to ensure that physical attacks didn't wreck me, and then blast away as quickly as possible before she overwhelmed me with damage. It was a really engaging fight that got my brain muscles really moving, although I have no idea how I'd have done it on difficulty 1 lmao.

That reward was meant for NG+ but gg!

My proudest memory of VD was when one player was stuck on Shiva difficulty 1 and we sat down with 2 or 3 other players and everyone found a unique way to beat her from that player's savefile. No grinding, just switching around a few items and skills. :D

6 hours ago, borker223 said:

So yeah, this hack has been great so far, and I look forward to playing more of it. I'll probably post a more as I get further into the game. Thanks for taking the time to make this!

Do that but don't hold your breath for another mod update from my side anytime soon; life's been busy.

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I just logged back in for the first time since last year. Also, I'm noticing a significant lack of documentation on what jobs give what abilities and where to learn the new blue magic. A fix to at least the latter of the two would be appreciated.

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On 6.10.2022 at 12:34 AM, Lunarman.EXE said:

I just logged back in for the first time since last year. Also, I'm noticing a significant lack of documentation on what jobs give what abilities and where to learn the new blue magic. A fix to at least the latter of the two would be appreciated.

Did you check the xls files in the zip? The former should be in classes.xls.

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13 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

Did you check the xls files in the zip? The former should be in classes.xls.

Not until now, because I only recently figured out how to properly open xls files. Though I'm more concerned the about the blue magic locations...

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Hi long time since I posted...Mr praetarius I think I found the answer to how I got a 31st job level...when you don't switch jobs immediatly after mastering one it still builds points towards other jobs when you do switch(I don't know if that's intentional or not.. not the point)...those left over points can go over the needed amount to level up as shown here and carry over...I assume that's what happened before and I held on to so many points that it gave me a non existent level when I changed?

Screenshot_20221205-180751_Snes9x EX+.jpg

Edited by verninater
Msspelling

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Also I find it weird that freelancer has both a scan skill in basic..and comes equipped with examine...also also (probably stated in the documentation somewhere but I can't find it) is there a way to use the hack exclusive classes(minus lord) in single job mode? It only shows the normal classes when using it like with sage stone(again except lord replacing freelancer)

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