thzfunnymzn

...I have simply never considered trying to abuse "Umaro Throws Mog for 9999" strats. And, with a severe lack of experience, I'm not sure how to theory-craft them properly. Kneejerk thought is that they're technically sub-optimal, although probably very fun and perhaps far less sub-optimal than other sub-optimal options (mostly sub-optimal because of Umaro, though Cover Umaro does exist nowadays?). Still, without at least 2-3 runs of actually giving it a shot, I simply cannot comment, not even pairing Sage Mog with it.

Looking back through this topic, it seems SirNewtonFig kinda hit on the only real gameplan I thought was really worthwhile for Sage Stone Mog: a Dance Mog, primarily Forest Suite, who uses X-Magic for its utility and more reliable damage. And, in that regard, his conclusion isn't totally dissimilar to mine: the gameplan works, but it doesn't feel totally satisfying. (I've traditionally looked to X-Mog as a full-on "X-Quake blaster caster with Crystal Orb", which....I don't think really works out too well). Again, never played Sage Mog + Umaro, though I'd wager that if it's this Dance Sage Mog with Umaro, it's probably working fine.

Defeated Kefka. Had to level grind up to lvl 34/25 in order to defeat him though. T1, T2, and Kefka himself are no jokes.

Team: HP/MP Terra, mag Edgar, mag Strago, mag Relm. (spd Relm would've been much superior. Oh well)

General Strategy: Strago is damage unit using 1.10's X-Dark. Occasionally uses Black Omen. Uses Shield prior to T2, and Holy Wind / X-Items as needed. Relm is Rerise / Cure 3 support, as well as occasional damage. Terra is tank and healer, with the occasional damage. Edgar provides the critical SlowX for T1 and T2, as well as being another support unit, especially since I'm low on Ethers. (Fast foes = lots of healers, one big damage dude).

T1: Strago picks off Face (9999 x2 damage thx to weakness), Left Arm (also big damage, low mg.def), and then Right Arm (also big damage). Edgar uses SlowX, Hastes / heals everyone, occasionally run Battery support (I'm low on Ethers). Relm and Terra do their thing. Strago sets Shield before going to fight T2.

T2: Lost twice due to sheer bad luck (Berserk and Freeze; no Ribbon and no stamina). SlowX is essential to getting this guy under control. T1 and T2 are perhaps the only fights in the game where I feel like I actually want high stamina. Memorized actual opponents here: top-right Hit was nuked with X-Dark (9999 x2), bottom-right Tiger was nuked with double Ice 2 (6000 x2), top-central Tools is nuked with Terra's Bolt 3 (9999), and far-left Magic is nuked with non-elemental, ignores target defense (Ultima, Black Omen, Flare; the Big Magics).

T3: Breather battle. Nuke the Girl with Big Magics, keep everyone healed up, pick off Sleep with X-Dark. Getting Rerise back up after T2 is desirable for Kefka.

Kefka: After summoning Bahamut and Ragnarok (9999), the only attack that ever happens is X-Dark, doing 4.5k - 5k twice over. Surprisingly smooth when only one guy is attacking (still a very tense battle that burns many X-items), though I had a scare when Relm got Muddled and nuke Terra with a Punisher Rod. Kefka never used Goner.

Kefka hard-walled me when I tried fighting him at lvl.30. (Surprisingly, I made it past T2 once, though with Shadow replacing Terra b/c of T1). His elemental tier 3's OHKO'd the squishes and I only had one healer. Gaining levels for HP certainly helps.

***

I have conquered NHT. I've had my fill of challenge, next game is a normal BNW. Might even get the chance to play with c/c more outside of Celes and Umaro. Also, Terrato Sabin!

Commenting on 1.9 in general:

Defeated Warring Triad. Only Kefka remaining. Everyone's at 30, except for a few at 31.

Team 1 is Team Chakra: HP Sabin, HP/MP Terra, Phantom Celes, mag Strago. After the fork, they'll fight Asura. Also, again, testing out the in-development Dark for 1.10. (Slightly higher BPow, but also slightly higher MP cost).

Team 2 is glass cannon team. mag Edgar, mag Relm, spd Gau, vig Cyan. I thought they'd fight Myria (Flurry & Hurtmore), but they fought Isis instead. Oops.

Team 3 is a bunch of bulky dudes and a ninja. Kirin Locke, vig Mog, Bank Setzer, and spd Shadow. I thought they'd fight Isis, but they fought Myria instead. Oops.

***

Unless Kefka pulls a surprise, Nowea, I think you've gotten most of my feedback. There's a few bosses that need to be looked at (Phunbaba especially), and Back Attacks need to be less "rng kill you". Also gonna agree with Deschain that HP ELs have been lowered a bit too much. I'd at least bring them back up to 2/3 strength (+20, +40).

I'll comment more on general 1.9 thoughts some other time.

3 hours ago, F-Bomb said:

In my last playthrough of 1.9.0 I used seibaby's encounter patch v4, and I believe that by the end I was at least 2 or 3 levels lower than my 1.8.6 playthrough. I think I ended up between 28 and 32 for all characters, with EL's from 19 to 23,  I think that this is a good way of lowering levels without messing around with too much else. Also I never had to grind to keep up either. Im not sure if I play faster slower or what not, but  my playthrough was 52-54 hours. Which is a decent game, considering vanilla is usually 32 hours for me.

IIRC, work is being done to make seibaby's encounter patch fit for mainstream release. IIRC, currently, there are technical issues with it.

That said, I would definitely appreciate a patch that raises the minimum number of steps taken before an encounter. Hiking to fight the Ice Dragon in NHT got real annoying when every (other) step in town of Narshe was an encounter.

1 hour ago, Budcakes said:

Something that might help alleviate this problem somewhat is to provide a pretty clear recommended progression in game via NPC or PC dialogue, so the player has some idea what dungeon they should tackle next.

All ready provided. Order of progression is Mt. Zozo -> Veldt Cave (also, nearby Terra and Gau) -> Owzer's Mansion -> Phoenix Cave -> everything else -> Cultist's Tower -> Kefka's Tower. The first three of those dungeons definitely feel easier than stuff like Cyan's Soul, Narshe, or Zone Eater's Cave, with Phoenix Cave kinda in the middle of these two sets in terms of difficulty. Outliers here are Ancient Castle and Ebot's Rock, which feel easy despite coming in the "later" set of WoR dungeons.

8 hours ago, Mishrak said:

What part of the game are you referring to as mid-game?

Probably best if we use mid-WoB, late-WoB, early-WoR, instead. Even mid-WoR is kinda ambiguous, as it could be split into two.

While better than other parts of the WoB, for the player's current power, the FC mobs aren't as strong as the Zozo and IMF mobs were for the player's current power then. So, a buff to FC mobs isn't necessarily a bad idea.

Mog's brutal on the FC. Many versions ago, I had a Mog who solo'd Ultros and Chupon with Earth Blues, whereas I normally have trouble with those buggers. Let alone Forest Suite = Win for Atma.

Blood Sword has only just now found itself useful with C/C, so I don't want to nerf it too much. I'd like to see more results from a properly leveled Locke alongside c/c Terra and c/c Celes before drawing conclusions. Also, if FC mobs are buffed, I'd want to see results from that before addressing anything.

FFVI does seem to design Locke's level curve such that he'll be slightly overleveled for the late-WoB, balanced by him returning late in the WoR. That can't really be helped, so it's not really the player's fault if Locke gets overleveled. May even be best to work with mid-game balance assuming an overleveled Locke.

Also, I'm all for mid-game balance discussion. It's a little difficult to really do so, but I'm all for it. Though I think it mostly revolves around the Floating Continent portion and the Zozo / Imperial Magitek Factory portions of the late-WoB. Sealed Cave, Burning House, Mt. Thamasa, Sunken Figaro Castle, Daryl's Tomb, all give no choice in party, with many being breather dungeons by design, so there's little balance to discuss there outside of maybe a few cases of "party feels op here, build doesn't quite work here, etc"). Course, that still leaves the balance of the post-Falcon WoR. (Also, the balance of late WoR but not quite end WoR, though that's probably pretty close to endgame balance and/or mostly a breather before the endgame).

I second Schemp. Schemp is amazing.

Tbf, though, the Dream Stooges definitely look and act like the juvenile type, so them swearing like sailors doesn't quite reflect so badly on BTB and Synchysi. I'll happily take toning down the obnoxiousness of their swearing, but the stooges are definitely the juvenile type. (Them attacking each other was kinda amusing too. It's their antics that help lead up to Schemp being amusing. All on his own, out of nowhere, Schemp would be out of place).

Mog's good at helping Cyan clear his soul, kupo!

4 hours ago, Nowea said:

Snip

I think nowea is right. Looking at the physical damage formula, I am pretty sure that going from 18 to 24 does represent a nearly twofold increase in damage. Cyan being 22 compared to 18 would be a 50% increase in damage output as well, alongside a good chunk of HP.

Hmm...Sacrifice...

For Cyan, he can't equip shields and had no op armor. Kirin should be a bulky build, Bismark should hit hard. Seems like the issue is that Cyan can too easily get high HP/bulk and high damage in midgame, eliminating any need to choose one. (Hyper Wrist c/c is a good catch. 20% more damage than Power Glove to boot).

Locke, I'm less certain on. Maybe it is just bulk vs damage again, but Locke's not as simple as Cyan, and I don't want to shoehorn everything into that paradigm. (I'm a wee bit too numbers oriented). He is still relatively simple though, maybe?

I, unfortunately, have little experience with the new c/c, and it is starting to show.

Hmm....half damage on C/C definitely reduces its ability as an offensive move (emphasizing its defensive benefit), but that asks the question of whether or not all C/C characters are doing op damage at multiple points in the game, or if its just Locke and Cyan on the FC. I'm about to run a C/C Phantom Celes through the final dungeon with an auto-crit (uses MP on critical) weapon, so we'll see if the damage keeps up in the WoR's equivalent of the FC. MP maintainence is a potential issue with it, as is whether or not Celes can take the hits (though that may be an issue of deliberately playing hard type, >_>). The weapon also ain't a drain weapon.

Self-healing being the problem, iunno. Self-healing potential has definitely been around long before C/C, though if a large enough set of people try C/C and come to similar conclusions, we could induce that maybe that's the issue. Otoh, Celes and Terra, like Locke, have Drain Attack potential, alongside self-heal, dual-wield (Drain Blade + Scimitar), good armor, HP ELs (Seraph, Unicorn), etc, etc. Locke's got speed, but they have way more healing potential then he does at the moment.

Anyone able to test Blood Sword + Scimitar C/C FC strats with Unicorn/Bismark Terra and/or Seraph/Phantom Celes?

Mog, IIRC, cannot C/C and Dance at the same time. Dance doesn't allow for Cover. Sounds like C/C Mog will come into his own more in the WoR, when he gets better HP+ access as well as really, really good Rods. (Doomstick and Punisher are what I'm eyeballing). Unfortunately, WoB Mog is mostly Dance Mog; he can evolve several different ways afterwards, but for now, looks like he's stuck Dancing.

Edgar has Cover on Spears, yeah, but unfortunately, he's trying to play the "Cover as a defensive manuever" game, which doesn't work out to well. There's no spear that's really good for non-Dragoon damage, and even if there was, damage Edgar is what vig Edgar is for. >_>

I can definitely see Hyper Wrist as not op in this case. Hyper Wrist Cyan in those fights ain't nothin' you can't do with Flurry Cyan. : p

Budcakes, you are talking to the man who been infamous for years for huge, long rants about minute points of balance in a mod of a 20 year old SNES game. I, at least, ain't throwing a single stone at you for your posts.

***

You are using the Hyper Wrist, something I've never toyed with. Another veteran used to use that thing in randoms to kick butt, so perhaps Hyper Wrist is just bonkers for randoms, balanced by the fact that few people bother? Iunno, rarely bothered with it.

Did you miss the Golem esper? Sabin has an HP esper for the WoB. It is a reduced HP esper (HP/vig), and yeah, Sabin ain't good for c/c, too little def & eva.

Only half of a character's evasion is supposed to apply when Covering. Does it feel like Locke's dodging less often when he Covers, or might there be a bug?

Cover being mostly useful as an offensive tool when paired with Counter kinda bugs me, as the whole idea of Covering for someone is to take a hit for them. Obviously, you'd counter the opponent in return, but fundamentally, it's concept is that of a defensive manuever. The issue there is mostly one of % rates, not working for single-target magic attacks, and not working for AoEs. Working for single-target magic attacks would be interesting at least. Not sure I'd want to see the other two changed.

Kirin Cyan is stupidly powerful, possibly op, for the mid-game. I think he always has been, I've seen a returning veteran continue to think so for a recent version prior to C/C, and I think I remember another good player think him quite strong on the FC with c/c.

I'll have to parse more of what you said later (still points to be made). Right now, looks like there might be a midgame balance issue with the two Kirin builds. Dunno where the issue lies though.

Later

...huh. I knew Kirin Locke was best Locke for FC. Didn't know he was that good.

Hmm....

At least part of the issue is that, early on, you want HP. Granted, everyone who can wants a handful of HP ELs, but they also definitely want them up-front. Less options in the WoB means your stats matter more, and HP is the stat that gives the most immediate power. Also, player HP vs enemy damage is a tighter race in the WoB than the WoR (open-world design problems), and, again, HP is the easiest solution to that given the tools available.

Another part of that Cover/Counter strats were only just introduced (1.9), so they may not be finely tuned yet.

Which...leads into the idea of what all C/C strats in the midgame are imbalanced. We got "Kirin" Locke, "Kirin" Cyan, Phantom Celes, "Unicorn" Terra (probably Uni/Bis), "Unicorn" Edgar, and Maduin Mog. Maybe Ocean Claw c/c Sabin? Sabin might not last under fire though. (I hear some people like c/c Shadow >_>). Purely in terms of characters, Locke, Cyan, and Edgar all stick out as being able to equip for all three of "Counterattack", "Cover", and "Physical Damage +25%". (Technically, so can Mog and Shadow, but I'm doubtful on their usability). I didn't find Unicorn Edgar particularly op when I tried him (didn't tried 2H Spear, granted, but I doubt it). If Cyan ain't op, maybe part of the issue is that Ninja Mask comes to early? (It's endgame worthy, it could theoretically come in the WoR).

There's also the idea that Cover is meant to be a party defender option while Counter is supposed to be extra offense, yet they both key off of stamina. Granted, C/C strats should exist, but maybe keying off of stamina, alongside lower Cover rate with higher Counter rate, creates a problem? Problems with the calculations, however, are harder to prove and require a lot more playtesting and data. I'd rather not push for those changes without hearing more about how other c/c character perform in the midgame, lategame, and endgame.

***

I should mention, as a technically, that Locke's WoR esper is actually pretty important for his builds. Locke likes his MP. Also, as a gameplay tip, FC Shadow is probably better off running support (you noticed Healing Shivs; Smoke Bombs, Float, Haste, and Rerise also help) rather than trying to dps. Also, Shadow's Throwables are buyable back in Jidoor, which...is actually easily forgotten. I'd prefer if some of his Throwables were also buyable in Thamasa, as a timely heads up to the player.

Otherwise, welcome to the community, and with what a bang do you enter. Certainly good points to ponder over.

1 hour ago, Bropedio said:

* Myria and Yeti were BY FAR the most difficult boss battles for me. Perhaps I was not paying enough attention to countering behavior, or perhaps they are slightly unbalanced.

Yeti's a jerk, definitely. Myria's tough, but there are some strats to that make her very manageable. Mostly having to do with elemental resistances and countering her status game in Aero (Sap), Overcast (zombie) and Mind Blast (multiple).

1 hour ago, Think0028 said:

Updated with a different math and resistance interaction at BTB's request. Basically, most of the time resist + not being weak = resist.

So, mostly just "nulling one element won't completely nullify a multi-elemental attack"?

Cultist's Tower done. Easiest time I've ever had with this place. HP/MP Terra, spd Shadow, HP Sabin, mag Strago.

For the randoms, adding Gale Hairpin, Back Guard, and spd Shadow with Warp to the Reflect Ring set-ups makes it much easier to skip all the encounters here. They never once did major damage to me, despite NHT's double speed. Therefore, I childishly stick my tongue out at this place. : p

For the Holy Dragon, everyone's at level 30, equipped with HP boosters, and with decent enough stamina for mg.dmg variance to matter. (Despite playing mag Strago, Strago's stamina meant Holy came just short of a OHKO. This proved very crucial to keeping my momentum going). After the initial buff / debuff phase, the strat is that Terra's the healer, Shadow runs other support (Rerise, HasteX, Smoke Bombs, spot-heals when Terra's not available), HP Sabin spams Chakra (used Mantra twice), and X-Dark Strago is the dps. Terra and Shadow are running White Capes to avoid my support structure getting halted by Mute. X-Dark's great dps for this fight, but I'm also playtesting a proposed 1.10 idea: a Dark that's stronger but costs more MP (from 72 to 90 BPow, from 32 to 42 MP), so that X-Dark is more useful as a general-purpose attack (instead of just for Poison weakness or low mg.def). Idea is that X-Strago gets a true general-purpose, top-tier dps attack, but the high MP cost should mean he wants Figaro support.

Even if I hadn't run a stronger X-Dark, this was definitely my easiest Holy Dragon fight in a long, long time. (New X-Dark meant 14k damage instead of 11k. Still breaking the damage cap). Everything went very smoothly. So...another toast to Chakra Sabin, although part of that toast also goes to just having high HP. I like high HP. It's nice finally having high HP. * glares at nerfed HP espers * Course, I did most of the WoR "underleveled" (running into later WoR dungeons at below level 25), so some of this is my fault.

Oh, add spd Shadow to the list of people who like Chakra support, even though he doesn't care for it as much as an X-Mage.

Magimaster died a horribly, bloody death, as per usual. Do I need to comment on this fool?

***

Since I've got a real dps tool for Strago now, I did something unusual (for me) and traded out the Box for another Crystal Orb. Thamasa Duo are both getting an Orb for moar damage! If I hadn't had this new tool, I'd have probably kept the Box and used mag Strago more as a mixed & speedy support dude with good off-turn attacks. Both of which would've meant limiting Chakra Sabin to Relm + C/C Celes. With a real dps tool, I've got a few different options for how to build Chakra team; options are nice.

Only things left before Kefka's are Earth Dragon and Ice Dragon. (Oh, also, I ran from those forced pincers in Owzer's. Gonna go back for my mullah). I'll forgo a Chakra team for either since I all ready got my fill with Cultist's.

22 hours ago, SirNewtonFig said:

Enjoy! Morphed Terra spamming lategame spells, C/C Illumina Phantom Celes, and Stam Sabin for MP support are BFFs. It's one configuration where relegating Sabin to MP-recovery duty doesn't feel like a waste. Strago would make a great fourth wheel, bringing Shield, X-Shell, Refract, and some heavy Poison and Water elemental  coverage to the table. I've used Relm as the fourth in this configuration to great satisfaction as well. Having 3 characters who can all switch hit between healing and DPS like champs is extreme luxury.

I feel like it's high time I take a stab at NHT. This thread has me craving another run, and this patch should make things fresh enough. Maybe toss on a few beta patches (Elemental mixing, ephemeral reflect, encounter rate) for extra freshness.

Speaking of fresh new things, what is this Black Dart for Setzer you speak of? I don't recall coming across that before.

As Nowea said, I made a modification based on 1.10 development. Also making a change to Dark based on 1.10 development. X-Strago is going to wreck Holy Dragon.

For Chakra spam, my main issue has always been that I felt like there's too few configurations where it's truly useful, meaning it's difficult to use Chakra Sabin without pre-planning into specific set-ups. Chakra itself is pretty boss (1.10 development looks like it'll buff Chakra itself, which I'm not a fan of). C/C was just recently introduced, so my lack of playing 1.9 means I missed a new use for Chakra Sabin. Throughout most of BNW's history, Osmose was pretty op, so Relm and Strago didn't need Chakra support either, meaning Chakra Sabin was limited to Morph Boxless Terra, X-Mog, and X-Locke. I...I'm a stubborn mule, so it's taken me 2-3 playthroughs of recent versions to accept that new Relm does want Figaro support. Not sold on Strago wanting Figaro support (support spells are cheap, his dps is unimpressive without a weakness), but the aforementioned new Dark change is meant to change that.

EDIT: Also, technically, I'm running Terrato Sabin with a few Stray. So far, I prefer Terrato Sabin at Chakra support rather than Stray Sabin.

Finished Ancient Castle and Ebot's Rock. Only few last things (grind to 30, Dragons, Cultist's Tower), and then Kefka's.

***

Ancient Castle. spd Shadow, Phantom Celes, vig Mog, Bank Setzer. Start at levels 25/15, finish at 28/18. Ancient Castle and Narshe seem to be dungeons of the WoR that really give EXP; don't think I've gotten huge jumps in level in any other WoR dungeon.

Randoms were swept with a mix of Kunai, Fire Scroll (Zorathians), Jumps, Illumina, and Bank Setzer throwing the fancy Black Dart weapon talked about in Discord. I don't think anything really threatened me. Also got to have fun with Kagenui's X-Fight. WEAPON was handled with Water Scroll and Water Rondo; found 3-4 of them, so major EXP and EP.

Katanasoul perished under a mountain of Fire Scrolls and Illuminas. High HP (finally) means he didn't kill me with GP Toss.

Got fancy Genji Shield for for Phantom Celes.

For Water Dragon, Shadow, despite having high speed Bolt Scrolls, has no Water resistance, so, uh, he died a lot. (Forgot about Kagenui + Orochi strats, oops). Him dropping a lot was probably the chink in my armor for that fight. Otherwise, Celes and Mog did a good job pummeling the dragon while Setzer kept everyone healed up.

Return trip, however, I was majorly drained on MP, so I had to resort to Zantetsuken and Slots for return battles. Boxxy x3 is b0rked; I got hit with three S.Cross's in a row, no chance to react, and just flat died. >_< Otherwise, I made it through about the same as normal, just slower.

For Shadow, despite dropping a lot against the Water Dragon, performed well. I forget how powerful he is. Still dislike his frailty and lack of build variety. Oh well.

Phantom Celes was amazing and may be my new favorite build for Celes. Illumina hits plenty hard right now, and C/C does a nice job increasing her damage output. Didn't need the defensive benefits for Mog and Setzer though. Also, Illumina chews through her MP really fast. (Hmm.....chews threw MP fast, Cover to defend frail characters. I'm seeing a character to pair with stam Sabin and mages). Cover also defends people on the other side of a pincer, hilariously. Otoh, I'm concerned that she won't be as effective once enemies get harder in Kefka's.

Mogoon was Mogoon. Punisher strats would've been stronger, but enemies here were easy enough that I just stuck with Partisan for conserving MP. (And I talk so much about Punisher being better than Partisan). I did use Punisher strats for the Water Dragon though, for the extra damage. Dragon died right as Mog ran out of MP too.

Bank Setzer is invincible and has an infinite amount of MP. For just strolling through the dungeon, I had, effectively, an infinite amount of MP for throwing the Black Dart. Otoh, Seraph and Cures drained my MP after the Water Dragon fight, so I had to resort to Slots. Oh well.

***

Ebot's Rock was done with mag Strago, mag Relm, stam Sabin, and Kirin Locke.

Randoms died to X-Zone.

Hidon was a surprising bugger on Hard Type. Probably b/c of two low HP characters, forgetting to set Slow, and forgetting to summon Golem to handle early battle physicals. >_< Herp derp.

X-Fire3 did 12k damage to Hidon. (Yes, I used X-Locke with Kirin Locke. Omega Valiance was used for randoms).  Even when Locke's MP bottomed out (I used an Ether once) and I had to resort to Fire3-Fire2 combo while Sabin Chakra'd, he still did 9k. My main damage dealer.

Sabin spammed Chakra to keep X-Locke going. Also used Mantra a few times to restore HP, but eventually, Locke's MP meant he had to Chakra full time. Didn't bother with Aurabolt; actually, I competely forgot it existed. Wouldn't have helped, b/c I wanted to keep on Hidonite alive to prevent a respawn.

Strago, as usual, was kinda just there. He used Tsunami to help control Hidonites at first, but afterwards, resorted to Holy Wind, when he wasn't down on HP from Quasar. @BTB, please remove Poison absorb from Hidon, it's frustrating that Strago doesn't actually put down his rival from his youth. (Actually, please swap Fire weakness for Poison weakness. I want to blow up Hidon with X-Dark).

Relm did Relm stuff. Sketch'd for Black Omen, RegenX / Cure 3 at times, and used Flare (and got Mute'd in response).

I...really b0rked this battle. Should've had White Cape on Relm, summoned Golem, Slow'd him earlier on, etc, etc. >_< Stupid. Oh well/

***

Imma take stam Sabin, X-Strago, and Phantom Celes to one of the dragon fights. (Not Holy Dragon). Don't have a second Sage Stone, so can't do a double X-Mage strategy. Ah well, maybe I'll drag Terra or Relm along. Probably Ice Dragon, for the Morph Fire 3. Might also try to get this team working in Kefka's.

Otherwise, standard endgame ahoy.

WoR has too much grinding. Maybe I just play inefficiently.

Grinded out Hero Shield, made several trades in the Colosseum, and also re-spec'd Setzer to The Bank because of some discussion that's been going on in Discord and b/c Bank is just better than stam anyways. (OK, OK, GP Toss should start doing good damage once you stack enough stamina, but by that point, I'll have Fixed Dice. Sides, I got Umaro for c/c).

Ancient Castle will be spd Shadow, vig Mog, Phantom Celes, and Bank Setzer. My first actual test run of c/c Illumina Celes. We'll see how it goes.

Should be on romhacking.net. Look for Final Fantasy Zzonk, hack of the original NES game. Could also dig through the GameFAQs forums of the old NES FF1 for it as well.

Might want to consider playing the next update, and then maybe, a few years down the road, consider another go, if stuff has changed enough. Or wait for that magical 2.0 that will appear in the year 21XX. Little balance stuff just keeps happening: I remember Zzonk's FFI mod being under constant balance tweak development for 9 years, so I wouldn't hold my breath on little "balance tweaks" ending anytime soon, though the core game will remain the same.

Beat Phoenix Cave & Cave on the Veldt, grinded up Cyan (vig), Locke (kirin, with some phoenix), and Shadow (spd), grabbed Illumina, and am now ready to grind Hero Shield, kill Earth Dragon, and then conquer Ancient Castle. Mostly breezed through everything on auto-pilot. Hopefully, hard stuffs over until Kefka's, with a couple of exceptions (Holy Dragon).

Levels were mostly 25 across the board, with a few hitting 26. Terra hit 27 at some point, forgot when.

Also, I completely forgot to try out Phantom Celes these two dungeons. Uhh.....oops?

***

P.Cave, Dragon Killers: spd Gau, Umaro, HP/MP Terra, mag Edgar

P.Cave, Other Team: HP Sabin, stam Setzer, vig Cyan, mag Strago

Umaro and Gau wrecked the cave. 6k Hurtmores at top speed from Gau, and Umaro tanks stuff, kills stuff, and guards allies a ton. Terra & Edgar kinda just watched them half the time, with Terra having a knack for being turned to stone or getting killed by Blowfish (damsel in distress). The other half of the time, Umaro and Gau kept missing, so Terra would have to pick up the slack. Edgar kept Terra's MP going with the Battery, healed, and sometimes Muddled stuff. Only difficult fight for this team was Sea Flower x5, and half of the difficulty was the annoyance of watching Gau & Umaro slag through it while Edgar & Terra keep everyone healed.

The other team, otoh, kinda struggled a bit, with only vig Cyan really looking good. Tbf, I messed up my Strago strategy. I relied mostly on Raze and Tsunami, and while Tsunami turned out solid, Raze was kinda meh. Should've gone Rod + Black Belt for single-target damage. Probably should've tried some Shoat strats with stam Setzer, as half the time I did attack, I tended to use either Bio or attempt insta-death.

HP Sabin is a lie. Dude could barely scratch anything without Water/Ice weakness (Mus and Witches). Also, his HP gets chewed through very quickly, requiring constant healing. Which means no Cover strats for Sabin. Guess I can turn him into a Chakra battery instead.

Fire Dragon exploded. 8k Ice 3's from Morph Terra, 6.5k Blizzards from Umaro, Gau doing 3k Ninja Waves at ~80 speed, and he can barely hurt me because of my resistances. Tbf, claws and blowfish are threatening, and berserk is annoying, but mostly, he got 'sploded.

Oh, and I got Locke. Yay, Locke. I can now continue playing as Kirin Locke. I finally have more C/C users besides Umaro! (Umaro's still the best)

At some point there, Umaro threw Terra for 9k+ damage, whereas he was normally tossing people for 6k+ damage. Also, every other time he threw Terra, it was for 6k+ damage. So iunno what happened there. Also, pincer'd Sea Flowers + Wavecannon = minor graphical glitch of Wavecannon dancing around between which side it's gonna hit.

***

Cave on the Veldt was Chakra team. HP Sabin, HP/MP Terra, Kirin Locke, mag Relm, all 'sploding stuff with magics while Sabin supports. Can't really tell how strong the strat is overall because I'm nearly endgame strength running over an early/mid-WoR dungeon. Won't really get to know until I take it to Kefka's either.

It was mostly Relm and Terra 'sploding randoms with Meteor, Flare, Fire 3, and Ice 3. Locke did Cover fairly well, but it wasn't really necessary right now. Sabin never died and no one ran out of MP. Can't tell if HP Sabin is a better Chakra battery than stam Sabin b/c of survivability or if it's just being overlevelled.

Tiamat exploded. Morph Ice 3 and Flare followed by Morph Fire 3 and X-Fire 3 (without Rogue Cloak, but oh well). Didn't last long.

When Tiamat comes from behind, does that switch row or not? I assumed it did, but then I told Terra & Relm to switch rows and they go forward. Don't recall Locke ever Covering anyone after the switch either, though Tiamat did explode pretty quickly. Also, Tiamat Haymaker'd Morph Terra for ~1200 damage after she switched rows (going forward).

***

Eh, I kinda wanted too long to get Locke, Shadow, Cyan, re-spec Phantom Celes, etc, and now I don't have too much time to play with them before Kefka's. Also forgot to use vig Mog more and, being underleveled most of the time, had little time to play with Chakra. Oops. Otoh, I do know how vig Mog, Cyan, and Shadow work anyways.

I'll go 'splode the Earth Dragon next time before going to the Ancient Castle. Shadow's coming along for the ride, dunno who else is. Probably should bring Mog.

13 hours ago, A Dummy said:

I don't know about the other bosses, but it almost sounds like part of the problem with Hidon is that players aren't given a good reason to keep killing off the Hidonites throughout the whole fight after the first time, probably not something directly damage related but something strong enough that just getting damaged by Black Omen would be preferred.
I don't know what exactly though, like maybe he starts using Rasp a bunch if the Hidonites are left alive for so long, and that timer gets reset after clearing them, so if you try to just leave one alive your MP starts getting drained away but if you keep on top of clearing them you don't lose as much of your resources over the course of the fight. (Or something along those lines anyway.)

Yeah, problem here is that it's too easy to keep Hidonites under control. Leave all but one alive works too well. Even barring that, the player should have really strong AoE options by now, making it still a relatively simple task to clear them as they respawn.