rpschamp

If you cheat on one final class and take Wanderer instead of Rogue, then lo and behold, you have my current team :-) This team kills it after the first class change as Light Hawk, Light Angela, Dark Carlie have a ton of elemental versatility (six main elements plus Physical). Ranger is such a fun class to build as you can basically start by dumping everything into Luck. Wanderer will give you Magic Shield, so you would only need Sahagin's Scales or maybe Drake's Scales to boost your spells for bosses. Wanderer also gets some nice HP spells that should play well with Necromancer's final weapon. This team does struggle before the first class change with no shield or MT spells; probably best to focus mainly on physical stats during this early stretch (I did make use of the Scapegoat weapon, but this is not very Hawk-friendly as it makes his Luck stat less useful). I thought about the Regeneration ring for this team, but in the end I decided not to sacrifice the accessory slot. Carlie and Angela will need an accessory slot for saber/resist (MT and Dark Resist rings), and Hawk gets a ton of use out of the HP Steal ring plus other accessories like Quick Item or Heal Up that you want on your lead character during boss fights. Angela will also want the MT ring if you want to MT Heal Light and other spells. Carlie might be the best candidate after all, as her Spirit should always be high, but then with the MT Ring, you won't have space for anything else; in my case, I was thinking about trying some Undead builds later in the game. It might be worth it overall, though, as you won't get the after-battle heal until level 42 or something. Thank you for your review of Trials Set Rune Master; I think I'm going to avoid that team after all. I do like the option of OP builds through these rule-bending sets.... Wasn't that the point of these sets to begin with, to go back to the original mechanics? OP builds can be fun, but I think I would miss out on the challenge of some of the tougher fights.

Second this. Loving Thunderstorm this round. I am focusing on my first team at the moment (Light Angela, Dark Carlie), so Nesouk, you will get to Ancient Curse or Meth Angela before me. I'm looking forward to your review; I'm still undecided on this set. It looks awesome for mobs but limiting in terms of options for boss fights, which are ultimately the most important.

Saber resist shouldn't work well for this team anyways due to Trials equipment neutralizing elements. Thanks Nesouk and smileless for your recent suggestions! Being the Angela/Carlie freak that I am, I'm now running two teams in turn: 1) Wanderer, Grand Divina, Necromancer 2) Fenrir Knight, Rune Master, Bishop This will give me a chance to use both Light and Dark Angela and Carlie for my first post-2.0 run. I'm as far as the first class change for both teams and will be posting more as I go.

In this case, Angela's VIT capstone should be great for Undead armor. Also great for Grand Divina; her damage spells will cost only 3 MP. I may give Grand Divina, Wanderer, Necromancer a shot on my next playthrough after all....

Funny enough, I've actually been thinking about this team for a while and considering it for my next run.... I'll list some thoughts here; I think 2.0 gives some nice new options to try. I've used a team similar to this in pre-2.0, and I don't think you will be lacking spell damage: Grand Divina and Necromancer make a strong casting team, and with Wanderer even more so. Just stock up on Sahagin's Scales for Mind Up during boss fights when you need a damage boost; later in the game when you need it, you will also be able to boost your damage with sabers from Angela's final weapon. Speaking of sabers, it might even be worth considering going for Hawk's PIE capstone to take the burden off of Angela and free up her final weapon. By the later part the game, Angela is going to be a fun lead character here since her elemental spells will be close to instant, giving you no reason to switch off her before casting them, and having a choice of weapon will be nice (Magic Up, Heal Up, Magitech, etc.). Also, this doesn't apply to your setup as listed, but I wonder how Angela's VIT capstone would interact with Necromancer wearing Undead armor or ring and her final weapon: would it heal or hurt her by 50 HP? If it heals, this could be used to create a stable low-HP Necromancer build; basically increase Necromancer's defenses with Undead equipment so the damage she takes is decreased significantly, and heal her as necessary 50 HP at a time while keeping her HP down as much as possible. It seems to me that a balance could be achieved here to keep Necromancer dealing massive damage with her Level 2 elemental spells. If it hurts, then you would need some other way to achieve the balance while Angela chips away at Necromancer's HP to keep her in the high-damage zone; otherwise you could go all out with Death Bringer gear. In both cases, Wanderer's Life Booster and Half Vanish should help to get Necromancer into the zone of high spell damage from the start. If any team can play to Necromancer's final weapon, this should be the team to do it.

Awesome fight. What filter are you using? The text is a little funky, but everything else looks great :-)

I'm taking it slow, but so far my Lise/Angela/Carlie run has been a lot of fun. Jewel Eater went down pretty easy for once; my trick here was to forget that this was a spell-casting team for the first 10-12 levels and build up everyone's physical stats enough to take advantage of the HP Steal ring. At this point in the game, the only way to get tech points is to attack, and you need tech points to recover via items, so spending a lot of time casting can really hurt you. The Mind Status Resist helms were also a MAJOR help, with Tzenker too; this helm is the best thing since sliced bread for a team like this. Plus, if you are using tech points to recover your status, you are not using them to heal. I think the weakness for Jewel Eater should be "efficiency" or "vigilance" instead of "preparation". At my first class change I chose Rune Maiden, Delvar, Priest; Tzenker was a joke with this team. I took Diamond Saber at my first Priest level-up and cast it on Lise and Angela to turn them into damage machines; for equipment, I used Mind Status Resist helms, Remove Weakness armor on Angela, and Quick Item ring on Lise to keep her tech points up for more earth-elemental Level 2 techs. The whole battle lasted somewhere around 60-90 seconds; I was back at my save point within 3 minutes. I will be playing more during this long weekend and will be hoping to make progress towards my second class change. I'm still thinking Fenrir Knight, Rune Master, and either Bishop or Sage; now, I'm leaning more towards Bishop for the Magic Shield and easier/more compatible MT sabers (Rune Master picks up MT Diamond Saber and MT Ice Saber easily, while Bishop picks up MT Thunder Saber and MT Flame Saber easily). I'll be missing Dark element on Angela and Carlie, but I suppose Fenrir Knight could help out there; plus, I may be able to mostly get by with dedicated casters for five of the six main elements. I am so far undecided on the Trials Set; I'm not sure how much of a bonus the minimal cast-time will be compared to the traditional method of Quick Cast helm/building AGI, nor whether it will offset the negative effects of the Trials Set and not having equipment slots open for things like Flame Saber resistance. It's definitely worth a "trial" though; I'm looking forward to seeing "Meth Angela" throwing Level 3 elemental spells all over the place :-)

Agreed. I go back and forth between Normal and Hard, but I've decided on Normal for my current run. It's a nice sweet spot, and the fights are still a lot of fun. I always do this in Seaside Cave; I just skips screens until I find a Papa Poto. A good place to collect Poto Oils as well.

Haha well I wasn't actually considering it, just commenting on how ridiculously difficult it would make the game. Which is why perhaps there should be some commensurate bonus for it... though I can't imagine what that would be.... Yes, I agree; I think I'm going to go for it. Rune Master seems ideally suited, and Fenrir Knight can keep her casting if played correctly :-)

This is along the lines of what I was originally thinking and seems more fair since the benefit of the Trials set appears to be quite nice. MT Silence may help with this; also, with the death score locked, it shouldn't be as much of a problem.... Now Trials set on all three characters... oof.... Maybe there should be an extra bonus for that?

So, to take this further.... Rune Master will learn everything but Thunder Saber and Flame Saber, giving her all four Level 3 elemental spells, Fenrir Knight will learn everything but Transshape and Poison Bubble, learning all the MT debuffs and Moon and Leaf Saber, which will be great for Rune Master, and Carlie.... here, I think Light Carlie would be best for MT Heal Light and Sabers to enhance Angela. Bishop offers Magic Shield, the two remaining basic elemental Sabers, Power Up which works well with Trials Buff, an easy spot for Resistance (still important for Lise and Carlie), and Saint Saber to power her own spells, while Sage offers the missing Dark element and Curse, Mind Up, Life Booster, Leaf Saber to let Fenrir Knight learn Resistance, one of the two remaining basic elemental Sabers, and a final weapon which I believe ticks HP regeneration even through spell animation, something this team will be seeing a lot of. Again, I think I'm leaning towards Sage. Capstones? Lise's AGI would help with Fenrir Knight's counter, and Carlie's LUK would help with keeping MP up between counters. Angela should probably go for PIE due to her cursed equipment, but VIT and INT look strong as well. One of the obvious benefits here is that the Trials set helps with this team's lack of Speed Up, so as long as I master Fenrir Knight's counter, this team should be a monster. Now, this looks like a team that can compete with Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Evil Shaman/Necromancer. Let me know if you have any more ideas!

This is a great idea, and perfect to pair with Fenrir Knight. I'm a little concerned about Trials Defense's "no defense vs. Level 2/3 techs".... but definitely worth a try if I choose this path.

I think Dark Angela would do better than Grand Divina here. I've always been tempted to put Fenrir Knight on the same team as Dark Angela or Dark Carlie to take advantage of the MP recovery, which was the purpose of Team 2 described above: Fenrir Knight, Magus/Rune Master, Bishop/Sage. Two options: 2a) Fenrir Knight, Magus, Bishop: No Speed Up, but pretty much everything else. Almighty Magic armor on Magus to cast Annihilator every time Lise lands a counter seems like a reasonably viable strategy against bosses, but kind of one-note. Bishop would provide easy Flame Saber resistance, and Angela has an easy path to her AGI capstone to make up for the lack of Speed Up. 2b) Fenrir Knight, Rune Master, Sage: Weak on buffs, but Mind Up is the most important buff, Life Booster can help for bosses, and I'm not sure that you need all three of Protect up, Power Down, and Saber resistance; most players just use the first two, while it seems that either of the first two combined with Saber resistance should have a greater benefit to physical defense. Plus, Sage has Dark Force which frees Angela to go Rune Master, which just seems like an all-around more useful class for regular enemies (MT Snowman, MT Silence, picking enemies off with Stone Cloud) and bosses (Level 3 elemental damage for less MP; Level 2 damage that bypasses resistance/immunity when necessary). You would be missing Speed Up.... And Magus definitely has an easier path to her AGI capstone if you want to collect all of the Rune Master's Level 3 spells. But I may be tempted to stick that Constant Regeneration helmet on Rune Master so her cast-time isn't wasted.

I was thinking about this to free up Lise to go for Fenrir Knight, if only for her final weapon. Fenrir Knight could also invert instead if you prefer a better armor on Carlie. Comparing these two teams: 1) Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Evil Shaman/Necromancer - Lise can function as an alternative Saber caster (up to five elements with Grand Divina's final weapon) - Easy path to Saint Saber resistance - MP recovery through accessories - Silence - No need to use Invert Armor 3) Fenrir Knight, Grand Divina, Necromancer - MP recovery through counters (might not be as reliable) - No easy path to saber resistance - Need to use Invert Armor Though in general I prefer Fenrir Knight to Star Lancer (fun final weapon, better colors, awesome subscreen pose), I think Team 1 still comes out ahead. This one is debatable; Necromancer gets access to one more pure element of spell damage, as well as non-elemental spells (which is nice), but Evil Shaman still gets access to five of the six (plus Demon Breath), and with two of her final weapons in play and Lunatic for bosses, a smaller portion of the enemy's HP is in play, and the whole team benefits in terms of needing to reach an smaller goal. I think the major benefit of Necromancer here is Black Curse, or maybe some low HP strategy to keep the extra damage from her final weapon high. But I admit that the best choice is not very clear.

It's also interesting that Evil Shaman should not need to trade Ghost for Ghost Road in 2.0 if she fills her spell slots before reaching 20 INT, making her more boss-oriented (especially in Lise's final dungeon); with Saint Saber resistance, the group Power Down might not be as necessary....

Good call in pointing this out; it slipped my mind that Demon Breath has three elements. I do like that Evil Shaman gets access to Black Curse through a class change item, so this still might be the way to go. Good advice here.... Speed Up is not available here in any configuration, and Sage only gets Mind Up; however, casting a saber on enemies to reduce physical damage through elemental resistance can be an alternative, so I wouldn't rule this team out. Magic Shield should be quite a good spell for this team, but Fenrir Knight's final weapon can cover at least the MP regeneration part and keep HP up as well. Cast speed and elemental access are real issues, though, and Team 1) beats this team on both in any configuration.

Good discussions here! I'm running Lise, Angela, Carlie and I have a couple of ideas for final teams to bounce off the board: 1) Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Necromancer/Evil Shaman: Light Lise and Dark Carlie both get natural Light Resistance, so Star Lancer can cast Saint Saber on enemies to minimize physical damage if Angela wears an elemental resistance armor or accessory. Star Lancer and Grand Divina can cover all the buffs, and Necromancer or Evil Shaman can cover debuffs, depending if you want Black Curse or the group-targeted Ghost Road and Demon Breath. Evil Shaman may work better if Grand Divina goes for her VIT capstone as the Necromancer's final weapon might not be of much use. I like Lise with her INT capstone here: she could use Evil Shaman's final weapon for -1/4 boss HP as Nesouk pointed out (and I guess Lunatic subtracts another 20%?), or she could use Grand Divina's final weapon to cover 2-3 extra sabers (Evil Shaman can cover Protect Up) and free up Grand Divina's weapon slot, which would be especially nice if Grand Divina goes for her LUC capstone instead. Evil Shaman would also bring Anti-Magic, though I'm not sure how useful it would be on this team. Carlie could take Regeneration to help out with the healing and Lise could take Resistance. 2) Dragon Master/Fenrir Knight, Magus/Rune Master, Bishop/Sage: Dark Angela and Light Carlie both get natural Fire Resistance, so Angela or Carlie can cast Fire Saber on enemies to minimize physical damange if Lise wears an elemental resistance armor or accessory. The choice of final classes is tricky here. Fenrir Knight and Bishop/Sage would be a great team for HP/MP healing, but if I went with Bishop, Dragon Master's Enhanced Anti-Magic would help out with the elemental spell damage. Magus or Sage would be the preferable Curse casters to Fenrir Knight as Dark Force is much more efficient than Black Rain. I am tempted to choose Sage to free up Lise and Angela to go Fenrir Knight and Rune Master, but then the buffs would be quite limited, and the sabers spells wouldn't work out as well. There is some optimal configuration here that promises a ton of power, but it doesn't seem as straightforward as the first team. Rune Master would be a lot of fun: I've always wanted to try casting Petrify or Snowman on Lise with a status protection accessory and Thorn Armor (or Curse) off-screen and then let her go forward with a shield and reflect enemies into oblivion. Let me know what you think....

Does the Dream Res. shield protect against the same status effects as the Dream Res. ring? It's in the title, I know, but the spreadsheet indicates moogle/chibikko resistance for the shield and sleep/moogle/chibikko for the ring. Most likely the spreadsheet just wasn't updated when the shield effects were changed....

"Min 1" means a minimum reduction of one, correct? For example, a spell that costs 4 MP will end up costing 3 MP, even though the 20% reduction would still round up to 4 MP?

Nesouk as usual you are way ahead of me; I think Lise is a better choice than Hawk here for a number of reasons, but I will respond with more after I play a bit. Thank you for your input!

Actually, after these changes, since I was planning to start my new run today, I think I'm moving to Dark Lise, Angela, Carlie; I've grown a little bored of Dark Hawk, and Fenrir Knight is looking pretty damn good :-) Time to reboot the Femmes Fatales!

Big changes to Hawk this time! Does Shuriken still cost 8 MP to cast? I love the overall simplication of the cast time and spell damage system :-)

Thanks, Nesouk, somehow I overlooked this VIT capstone. You're right, it looks great with Grand Divina. She was my favorite class from pre-2.0, and now there are a bunch of new mechanics to try, so I think I will end up going with her. Can there be such a thing as too much healing? Vanadis (saber-resist through Wind resistance) might be an interesting alternative for Bishop for another good final weapon synergy with Grand Divina, but her stat/spell/accessory build looks awkward; plus, no Magic Shield for Grand Divina's MP Regeneration.

Great review, Nesouk. I would like to add that in general that the game feels very different with limited item use; at least in the beginning of the game, you have to be much more careful with how you spend your tech points, especially during boss battles. Now there are two turn-based action components: spell actions and tech actions, the second of which is only accessible by not casting spells. This balance becomes important for groups that spend more time casting, especially since it becomes important to invest tech points in counters to keep the enemy's rage down. I don't know whether this dynamic lasts into the late game when spells cast faster and tech points come more easily, but at least in the beginning the game feels much more strategic. For this reason, and for the reason that I miss her from my Ninja Master/Dervish/Sage run (pre-2.0 when Hawk and Kevin were killing it with tech points and Yellow Damage Heal weapons), I am building my first run around Angela. I'm planning to run Ninja Master and Bishop with her 1) to try a spell damage-oriented team that can pick up physical damage by the end game and 2) to take advantage of a saber-resist strategy through Fire or Earth. Ninja Master/Bishop give access to all of the debuffs and most of the buffs, provide a dedicated healer and saber-resist caster, and make a nice crit team with Analyze and Energy Ball, especially since the LUK capstones look pretty awesome for everyone: Hawk would get crit damage on a crit-oriented team, Bishop would reduce spell cost for the team, and Angela could use any weapon with her LUK stat. Hawk would be the only teammate to go for STR here since Angela and Carlie can pick up physical damage with their LUK capstone and final weapon. The choice of Angela seems more complicated, though, as there are a couple of interesting options: - Magus brings Dark Force/Curse Ring that compliments Bishop's skill set and unpins me from Thorns Armor to equip Almighty Magic Armor, fun things with Poison Bubble/Leaf Coat Ring/Explode/Rainbow Dust, and both Power Up and Mind Up (MT with MT Ring). The other major benefit is that no one would require an elemental resistance ring for saber-resist. Angela's AGI, INT, and LUK capstones all look good here, and I may be able to work it to give myself more of a choice as I approach Level 60. If I want all the sabers, though, Ninja Master would have to go for his PIE capstone, which would leave little room on him for Regeneration or Resistance, and Bishop would have to compensate. - Grand Divina with high INT, Constant Regeneration helm, MP Regeneration armor, Magic Shield, and Carlie's LUK capstone (does this round up or down for MP cost?), due to her low cast times, low spell costs, and the MP regeneration during spell animation offered by the helm, should be able to cast pretty close to constantly. And with the rework of the Rage system, this strategy feels a lot safer. This would negate any need for Poison Bubble, and Grand Divina would still get access to Curse through Evil Gate. Also, since Angela could cover the remaining Saber spells with her final weapon when necessary, Hawk would leave off his PIE capstone for certain and he and Carlie could share the accessory burden of Regeneration and/or Resistance. This would leave the team a bit physically stronger, and Angela could go for her LUK capstone to help out when elemental spell damage is not an option. At opposite ends of the spectrum in terms of cast times and spell power, there may be quite a gulf between how these teams actually play out. But this Constant Regeneration helm seems so interesting, and on the face of it Grand Divina looks to benefit more. Plus, Light Angela is a killer between the first and second class changes and gets my favorite tech in the game. I will update as I make progress through my playthrough.

Looks good! General question since you're putting out new versions of this mod pretty frequently at this point: how safe is it to use save files (SRMs) from older versions, let's say post 2.0, with new versions? Should any problems be expected, or would you just recommend restarting if the player wants the new version?