rpschamp

27 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

How is that off topic?

Off class-topic, but not off-2.0-Topic.

27 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

I still have open:
1 weapon
1 armor
2 accessoires

My only advice at the moment is to not finish up too quickly, if you plan to make this your last update. I'm hoping a few more players get involved and post their ideas as well.

21 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

I was going for a classical red mage here: fire, ice, lightning

Grand Divina and Star Lancer will be competing for that title :-)

53 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

No matter what you do, at best you get 2 ST buffs (def up, speed up) and 2 MT buffs or 3 MTs and lose one buff completely.

Have you thought about designing Vanadis to have the option to go for the 4 MT buffs, being the most support-oriented Lise class (with Heal Light, Tinkle Rain)?

Perhaps as in giving up Heal Light to learn all 4 MT buffs?

29 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

Starlancer:    32/30/30/30/30/30
Dark Saber (18 STR), Saint Saber (20 STR), Power Up* (23 STR)
Energy Ball (17 AGL), Ice Smash* (18 AGL), Speed Up* (20 AGL)
Airblast* (17 INT), Fireball* (19 INT), Mind Up* (22 INT)
Marduke* (18 PIE), Aura Wave (20 PIE), Def Up* (23 PIE)

Love the customization options here. Thematically strong too: Why would a girl who looks to the stars waste her time learning Diamond Missile?

This makes me really excited to see what you have planned for other classes.

First, I love the idea of putting Angela's level 1 spells on Lise. They're great spells and need more exposure, and Lise is a great option as the Jill-of-all-trades. (This basically covers the motivation behind my "magic sword" idea.)

Second, I can see why you "finalized" Angela first. Her relatively organized spell sets make her design options the most straightforward.

Third:

19 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

In short the char/class discussion topic will have field days here.

Is this not the ultimate goal?

Joking aside, if this becomes too rich, will you be able to resist doing a 3.0? (At least I can see the potential need for a 2.X to correct some problem that arises, since you're making so many changes here.)

Finally, off topic, do you still have a set of accessories open, or do you have plans to fill those in already?

11 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

Considering the buggy nature of snowman I want to keep it as limited as it is.
Considering the game breaking nature of petrify, same.

I have come to agree with you. Rune Master should keep her niche; giving Snowman to Vanadis would corrupt that.

11 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

I also may or may not take this opportunity to stealth nerf light Lise *cough*

This may be the most controversial idea of the topic yet. So much for stealth! You have my support though.

I think as long as there is an option for at least one of the Light Lises to learn her four stat buffs, there will not be mass revolt.

Very interested to see your ideas on balancing Vanadis and Star Lancer; the latter may have become a bit too dominant.

4 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

All classes have potentially 12 spells but can only keep 10.
If for some reason you have already 10 spells and the next would be an upgrade/replacement - tough luck.
Once the 10th slot is filled that spell learning is finished.

Very interesting; I like the stat-based series approach. Do you plan something similar for the other characters? Grand Divina will have to be careful to get that multi-target Evil Gate!

Looks good!

EDIT: Any changes to the final weapons? Or the status effects of Rune Master's spells? More generally, are you sticking with the plan to keep Snowman and Petrify exclusive to Rune Master (weapons included)?

1 minute ago, praetarius5018 said:

Nah, you should get the spell immediatly so you can see how much MP you should have and can adjust your stat gains if necessary.

As long as it doesn't introduce any new bugs haha, I agree this is the better route.

7 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

Ah, well I wanted to increase MP curve a bit anyway. I guess making sure you have 8 MP at 6 INT shouldn't be too much off.

This all sounds good to me; great new item. The ring could be set to teach Regeneration AT 6 INT, when you have enough MP to cast it, just like a stat requirement for a normal spell. Then there wouldn't be any weirdness; i.e. knowing a spell you can't cast.

5 hours ago, smileless said:

Ah the old days where the Dark Lord's were able to one/two shot your entire party with their level 3 techs whenever they felt like.

I have PTSD from this that kicks in sometimes during some of the later sequences.

7 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

After-battle effect is free, rest yes.

I just meant in terms of maxMP, since the original idea was that the caster could just cast the spells repeatedly as MP regenerates to recover HP before the next screen, but they would at least need the maxMP to cast the spell. Only Angela (and maybe Carlie) typically has 8 MP by the time you hit Maia.

At an 8 MP cost, few characters could actually cast the spell by the time they have the option to equip the ring.

6 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

I went with it granting the same effect as the regeneration ring which gets doubled effect but no longer stacks.

So the wearer of the ring learns Regeneration, which can be cast/upkeep to put a 1-5 HP/s regeneration effect on one ally at 8 mp. Do I have that right?

And does the after-battle heal effect require the wearer to have 8 MP?

4 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

I mean we already have a cursed ring that removes weaknesses and resistances, so one step further to a vanilla-like-set can't hurt

I suppose then that these are the truly cursed items :-)

19 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

I'm not sure I can find a HP/s value at this point that wouldn't royally break the game.
This would stack with the HP regen ring and Sage's weapon which together already maxes at 20/s (well, "second"). So that can easily recover 100~200 HP between boss attacks, do you take that much after buffs? Is even more easy regen really needed?

I have to take care that that value doesn't reach "afk mode".

edit: 25/s, the rings stack

One option for the Regeneration spell is to have it do either HP/time OR targeted HP recovery, depending on when it is cast,

i.e., 1-5 HP/s for all party members if cast outside of battle (1/3 the effect of current Gigas Flail), an early upkeep effect that some players might prefer,

OR targeted HP recovery if cast in battle, maybe half the effect of Heal Light.

You could have it cost 6 MP so most characters could actually cast it earlier.

The net effect would be that players would have to choose whether to pay the upkeep for a small HP/time effect, or not pay the upkeep, but be able to do targeted HP recovery during battle.

This would also get players used to managing upkeep early in the game, i.e. when and how to turn it on and off; certainly they would have to make this decision at least before every boss fight.

(major EDITS to this post made 9:20 am)

15 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

the 2 "remove weakness" helms get merged into one (beryl helm)

So the same effect as the Byzel remove weakness armor? Or do you plan to change that one?

15 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

• visored helm (pure p.def) gets status resistance to chibikko/moogle, silence
• hero's crown (status resist) becomes cursed and prevents stop of MP regen during casting

A chibikko/moogle/silence resist helm would be useful. But there would only be two resist death options, undead armor and Wishbone. I can see that.

15 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

protection helm (2nd remove weakness) becomes cursed with x1.3 p.def but 0 def against Lv2/3 techs for the true vanilla like experience

I wonder if there are actually players who would want to go back to this.... Joking aside, I could see this potentially being useful on a Star Lancer team.

20 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

hmmm... maybe lets compromise to Duran, Kevin and Lise having the aggro weapon and the other 3 something else

Thinking more about this Defender-class weapon.... Maybe it would be better to just have it increase physical and magical defense, instead of increasing aggro? That way, Duran and Lise could use this and shields at the same time, directing attacks towards them and taking less damage. Right now the only weapon that increases defense that I'm aware of is the deathless one, and there is already an option for evade.

3 hours ago, praetarius5018 said:

L50, 13 PIE, no heal bonuses:
regeneration - 115 MT, 143 ST
heal light - 168 MT, 210 ST

L50, 13 PIE, wendel armor:
regeneration - 138 MT, 172 ST
heal light - 191 MT, 238 ST

regeneration 8 MP, heal light 10 mp, regeneration casts a bit faster.

Old Heal Light was 9 MP and healed w/out that armor 140 MT, 175 ST or 166 MT, 207 ST with.

I guess this could work.

This looks good. But did you consider a HP recovery over time effect? It might be nice to distinguish it more from Heal Light, and also as an early introduction to the upkeep system.

Trust me, casters could use an aggro option; Hawk/Angela/Carlie is a thing, and I've been planning a Grand Divina-led team for a while.

12 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

Not in the way I've coded it.
Basically the AI had 2 options:

1. it checks who is closer, in those cases I simply cut the calculated distance in half
2. it selects a random target (mostly single target spells), here I simply give prio to a shield bearer

for 1. I could do double, but 2.?
Also I always find that form of aggro management stupid, I can believe it if a big guy just rubs himself into a bosses face to gain/keep aggro or basically taking his entire field of vision by shoving a shield into it.
But why would wearing a little ring make me "invisible" to him when he has already buried his claws into my flesh?

I don't think you should recode it, it works very well as you've made it.

I would just set the Defender-class weapons to aggro, like shields. It's okay if Angela and Carlie don't typically buy it; many of the weapons are specifically for fighters or casters, anyways. But making it universal would leave the option open if a non-Duran/Lise character wanted to act as a shield. This weapon is not available until late anyways, so it should only impact the endgame, mostly for Duran or Lise to refine their equipment, but perhaps also for a non-Duran/Lise-led team to pick up a useful strategy.

By the way, is there such a thing as negative aggro? As in, gtf away from me? Might be useful for casters :-)

10 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

hmmm... maybe lets compromise to Duran, Kevin and Lise having the aggro weapon and the other 3 something else

Kevin but not Hawk?

EDIT: I could also see Grand Divina using this nicely, leading a team with her near-instant damage spells, pushing enemies back as they come near.

8 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

20 minutes ago, rpschamp said:

Maybe a shield/aggro alternative that all characters could access later in the game?

I don't see why any of the other 4 would need this, at least thematically.

They may not need it thematically, but they may need it practically.

You could envision this as an alternative shield without the bonus status resistance. Maybe a medium strength weapon. Paladin may prefer this, for instance, to keep his accessories open, so he can still heal strongly.

14 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

Defender should obviously increase defense.

Maybe a shield/aggro alternative that all characters could access later in the game? (Duran and Lise would still have better shield options through most of the game.) I like this idea since other characters could become tanks in the endgame if necessary.

This might also be a good place for your superarmor/strong-attack weapon.

10 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

What I currently intend to do:
The two bird species get immunity to snowman so they can't trigger the bug.
Cold Blaze becomes the only source of snowman status.
Enemy attacks/specials that inflict it get it removed or something else.
Gear with snowman resist gets other status resist or replaced entirely if that is the only thing it does.

And the chibikko&petrify weapon probably get on the chopping block as well.

* nod in agreement *

Silence and Poison make more sense as melee-inflictable status effects. Petrify was too much, and Chibikko was never funny.

With immunities in place, Snowman could also go on Freya, but if you think it's too good for Vanadis, forget it. I don't want to advocate for Vanadis anyways; I don't love the class.

More new weapons to think about!

14 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

One option would be to make Cold Blaze inflict sleep instead. Same general effect, not (yet) known to crash the game.

If Snowman is too buggy, I think this is a good idea. Rune Master would still be awesome with Sleep.

But I think this is an important point. Lots of players love the Snowman effect, even with its bugs. Maybe start a new topic on the forum to get a general consensus on whether the bugs are worth it and decide later?

14 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

27 minutes ago, rpschamp said:

Getting rid of it would certainly make Rune Master less of an obvious choice for Angela.

Really? For general use I prefer Archmage, tbh.
6 elements instead of 4, and anti-magic to make sure she/her team is never element blocked (combos better for leaf coat purposes).

Good point; honestly I prefer Light Angela, Archmage and Grand Divina are such awesome classes, and Sorceress is great for the midgame. I just said that based on the general preference of the forum.

13 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

then explain the birds or other recently found status related crashes?

I can't. Are you thinking of taking away Snowman from Cold Blaze? This might be a good idea, to get rid of it entirely. Some players report stun-lock by repeat casting. Stun-lock should never be an option.

Apart from thematic arguments, mostly I don't like Snowman being stuck on one class.

Getting rid of it would certainly make Rune Master less of an obvious choice for Angela.

15 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

It is not only needlebirds, those are one of two species where I know that it causes a crash.

If you want to argue that snowman has nothing else that causes it - after that change it would be the same for chibikko being only available via body change.

Chibikko also has weapon effects and Necromancer's Great Demon, which Snowman does not.

Also, Snowman is a generally more useful status effect.

If Snowman were so bugged that Rune Master couldn't use it, then I would agree. But Rune Master is still a favorite of Angela's classes in Sin of Mana, largely because of multi-target Cold Blaze. Through Rune Master, it has already been play-tested.

48 minutes ago, praetarius5018 said:

as usual:
Vanadise can already do near everything.
heal, has the 4 main buffs, physical attack only slightly behind Duran, can tank if you give her a shield, maybe something else I'm forgetting.
If she now had drawback free nuking as well - when wouldn't you take her?

Star Lancer has two saber spells that can be used for saber/resist, an extra accessory slot (no need for Whitelight Ring), higher physical attack, a better status effect with her summon (even if Vanadis had Snowman), and good support spells in Aura Wave and Energy Ball.

Vanadis has Heal Light. Not as important if someone else knows Heal Light. (I think the item restrictions and regen ring will balance out with respect to Heal Light's importance.)

All Lise's classes have shields.

I don't think Vanadis's nuking requires a drawback. Anyways, Chibikko is more powerful than Snowman. Just less annoying.

EDIT: I think most players would rather take a bugged Snowman that they can't use on Needlebirds than Chibikko.

Leaf Coat is another option. Freya's chariot kicks up dust, including leaves? (Leaf-ing them in the dust?) The mythical Freya/Vanadis wears a cloak of falcon feathers... not far from a Leaf Coat? For me, it's more of a stretch than Snowman, but less of a stretch than Chibikko.