Party Suggestions 2.0

[smileless 0]

For my next runs (planned party members by the randomizer), what I got so far:

Carlie, Duran, Hawkeye
Carlie (main) - Necromancer
Skip Great Demon and Half Vanish
LUK capstone - spells cost less MP (important for Wanderer/Paladin if anything)
One way to build Necromancer around her final weapon is via life saver armor and blood magic to cast from HP instead of MP, might be a good strat considering this team lacks offensive part of Mind up, has 6 elementals covers

Duran - Paladin
Skip Anti-Magic (Wanderer covers that) and Protect Up (you got two users with Magic Shield)
PIE capstone (10 max mp)

Hawk - Wanderer
Skip Life Booster and Energy Ball
Unsure which capstone to choose, thinking of VIT (20 evade)

Team lacks the offensive part of mind up, but with Half Vanish you might not need that, especially using Wanderer's final weapon. Got two users with Magic shield And with MP increase and spell cost decreased Duran's exorcise spell comes in handy for Carlie's final dungeon.
Pretty heavy caster team without Angela lol.

 

Unsure yet what to make of the Duran, Angela, Kevin choice.

Edited May 18, 2021 by smileless

[Nesouk 49]

Actually since Wanderer's Half Vanish is reliant on ennemies's Max HP why not get Life Booster with him and cast it on bosses ? Might seems counter intuitive but IIRC if you debuff their Max HP with Lunatic their current HP will go down so the boss will have only 80% HP left, but then casting Life Booster increase their Max HP but their current HP doesn't move, so cast Lunatic so they have 80% HP remain then cast Life Booster on them twice to put their Max HP at 120% of their.

If I'm not mistaking going so with Wanderer would end up with Half Vanish doing 2,34375% of the boss remaining HP per cast, as an exemple if a boss at 10k Max HP Wanderer's Half Vanish at base will do 156 damage, you then reduce it to 8k with Lunatic and increasing it back 12k with 2 Life Boosters, so the boss has 12k Max HP but 8k remain and due to it's 12k mak Half Vanish will do 187 as oppose of 125 if you let him at 8k, compare to the base 156 that would increase Half Vanish Damage by 20%. Of course pointless to do if the boss has already 20480 Max HP or more at which point Half Vanish cap at 320 already but I don't think many boss have that much HP, also probably not safe to do on Zable Fahr.

Also Hawk's PIE capstone could be an alternative for increasing Carlie's spell damage without Mind Up, all you need is to equip the accessory that give regular attack the Element you want to get as Sabers and throw his LV2 Tech to turn it into a proper Saber effects (so giving it the +10% attack and boosting spells of corresponding element) and extend it to the entire party.

Nothing much to say about Paladin and Necromancer, this looks solid I'm interest in how effective Necromancer will be with such build.

EDIT : When I'll come back to this mod definitly gonna try that randomizer and just build around what it'll give me, looks fun ^^

Edited May 18, 2021 by Nesouk

[smileless 0]

6 minutes ago, Nesouk said:

Actually since Wanderer's Half Vanish is reliant on ennemies's Max HP why not get Life Booster with him and cast it on bosses ? Might seems counter intuitive but IIRC if you debuff their Max HP with Lunatic their current HP will go down so the boss will have only 80% HP left, but then casting Life Booster increase their Max HP but their current HP doesn't move, so cast Lunatic so they have 80% HP remain then cast Life Booster on them twice to put their Max HP at 120% of their.

If I'm not mistaking going so with Wanderer would end up with Half Vanish doing 2,34375% of the boss remaining HP per cast, as an exemple if a boss at 10k Max HP Wanderer's Half Vanish at base will do 156 damage, you then reduce it to 8k with Lunatic and increasing it back 12k with 2 Life Boosters, so the boss has 12k Max HP but 8k remain and due to it's 12k mak Half Vanish will do 187 as oppose of 125 if you let him at 8k, compare to the base 156 that would increase Half Vanish Damage by 20%. Of course pointless to do if the boss has already 20480 Max HP or more at which point Half Vanish cap at 320 already but I don't think many boss have that much HP, also probably not safe to do on Zable Fahr.

That looks like a viable strat, but then would have to give Paladin Anti-Magic and either skipping speed up or protect up. But that team might counter a variety of elementals througj Carlie and Duran to some extend so really Anti-Magic might be only needed for two bosses, gotta think about that.

9 minutes ago, Nesouk said:

Also Hawk's PIE capstone could be an alternative for increasing Carlie's spell damage without Mind Up, all you need is to equip the accessory that give regular attack the Element you want to get as Sabers and throw his LV2 Tech to turn it into a proper Saber effects (so giving it the +10% attack and boosting spells of corresponding element) and extend it to the entire party.

This looks interesting to try out, I wasn't sure what capstone to chose with Hawk, since the party lacks saber spells also that's one alternative to go and boosts Carlie's spells.

[smileless 0]

Limited in options when it comes to Duran,  Kevin, Angela (as far as I can tell) without having to sacrifice either speed up or speed down, spells like that, it all comes mainly to the party similar to the previous job thread that I tried but updated with 2.0+ changes

Duran - Lord
Skip Power Up, Energy Ball or Analyze doesn't matter much
Honestly main build might just give him a PIE weapon, max his PIE stat and just have him heal as he buffs/debuffs in between
AGI or PIE capstone

Kevin - God Hand
Skip Triple Spell, Life Booster
AGI or LUK capstone so maybe a crit build for him

Angela - Archmage
Skip Rainbow Dust, Aura Wave
Capstone: AGI (party casts faster) or INT (pierce 35 m.def)

Edited May 18, 2021 by smileless

[Nesouk 49]

18 hours ago, smileless said:

That looks like a viable strat, but then would have to give Paladin Anti-Magic and either skipping speed up or protect up. But that team might counter a variety of elementals througj Carlie and Duran to some extend so really Anti-Magic might be only needed for two bosses, gotta think about that.

This looks interesting to try out, I wasn't sure what capstone to chose with Hawk, since the party lacks saber spells also that's one alternative to go and boosts Carlie's spells.

You could also skip Aura Wave, I don't see you using a lot of tech with this team.

[rpschamp 0]

Good discussions here! I'm running Lise, Angela, Carlie and I have a couple of ideas for final teams to bounce off the board:

1) Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Necromancer/Evil Shaman: Light Lise and Dark Carlie both get natural Light Resistance, so Star Lancer can cast Saint Saber on enemies to minimize physical damage if Angela wears an elemental resistance armor or accessory. Star Lancer and Grand Divina can cover all the buffs, and Necromancer or Evil Shaman can cover debuffs, depending if you want Black Curse or the group-targeted Ghost Road and Demon Breath. Evil Shaman may work better if Grand Divina goes for her VIT capstone as the Necromancer's final weapon might not be of much use. I like Lise with her INT capstone here: she could use Evil Shaman's final weapon for -1/4 boss HP as Nesouk pointed out (and I guess Lunatic subtracts another 20%?), or she could use Grand Divina's final weapon to cover 2-3 extra sabers (Evil Shaman can cover Protect Up) and free up Grand Divina's weapon slot, which would be especially nice if Grand Divina goes for her LUC capstone instead. Evil Shaman would also bring Anti-Magic, though I'm not sure how useful it would be on this team. Carlie could take Regeneration to help out with the healing and Lise could take Resistance.

2) Dragon Master/Fenrir Knight, Magus/Rune Master, Bishop/Sage: Dark Angela and Light Carlie both get natural Fire Resistance, so Angela or Carlie can cast Fire Saber on enemies to minimize physical damange if Lise wears an elemental resistance armor or accessory. The choice of final classes is tricky here. Fenrir Knight and Bishop/Sage would be a great team for HP/MP healing, but if I went with Bishop, Dragon Master's Enhanced Anti-Magic would help out with the elemental spell damage. Magus or Sage would be the preferable Curse casters to Fenrir Knight as Dark Force is much more efficient than Black Rain. I am tempted to choose Sage to free up Lise and Angela to go Fenrir Knight and Rune Master, but then the buffs would be quite limited, and the sabers spells wouldn't work out as well. There is some optimal configuration here that promises a ton of power, but it doesn't seem as straightforward as the first team. Rune Master would be a lot of fun: I've always wanted to try casting Petrify or Snowman on Lise with a status protection accessory and Thorn Armor (or Curse) off-screen and then let her go forward with a shield and reflect enemies into oblivion.

Let me know what you think....

[smileless 0]

40 minutes ago, Nesouk said:

You could also skip Aura Wave, I don't see you using a lot of tech with this team.

Not necessary for tech, mainly wanted it for items but maybe that's not necessary.

[smileless 0]

32 minutes ago, rpschamp said:

1) Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Necromancer/Evil Shaman: Light Lise and Dark Carlie both get natural Light Resistance, so Star Lancer can cast Saint Saber on enemies to minimize physical damage if Angela wears an elemental resistance armor or accessory. Star Lancer and Grand Divina can cover all the buffs, and Necromancer or Evil Shaman can cover debuffs, depending if you want Black Curse or the group-targeted Ghost Road and Demon Breath. Evil Shaman may work better if Grand Divina goes for her VIT capstone as the Necromancer's final weapon might not be of much use. I like Lise with her INT capstone here: she could use Evil Shaman's final weapon for -1/4 boss HP as Nesouk pointed out (and I guess Lunatic subtracts another 20%?), or she could use Grand Divina's final weapon to cover 2-3 extra sabers (Evil Shaman can cover Protect Up) and free up Grand Divina's weapon slot, which would be especially nice if Grand Divina goes for her LUC capstone instead. Evil Shaman would also bring Anti-Magic, though I'm not sure how useful it would be on this team. Carlie could take Regeneration to help out with the healing and Lise could take Resistance.

You could manage without Anti-Magic id you have enough coverage in terms of elementals and some physical spell to toss around, that spell is mainly needed for two fights anyway, but it you go Evil Shaman you pretty much need it in order for her debuffs to work on enemies that are resistant to Demon Breath/Ghost Road, in that case get Anti-Magic.

32 minutes ago, rpschamp said:

. I am tempted to choose Sage to free up Lise and Angela to go Fenrir Knight and Rune Master, but then the buffs would be quite limited, and the sabers spells wouldn't work out as well. There is some optimal configuration here that promises a ton of power, but it doesn't seem as straightforward as the first team. Rune Master would be a lot of fun: I've always wanted to try casting Petrify or Snowman on Lise with a status protection accessory and Thorn Armor (or Curse) off-screen and then let her go forward with a shield and reflect enemies into oblivion.

Better play save and cover as many of the important buffs/debuffs, you have a caster heavy team so things like mind up, def up (or magic shield) and speed up are needed for their damage and defense.

Edited May 19, 2021 by smileless

[rpschamp 0]

33 minutes ago, smileless said:

You could manage without Anti-Magic id you have enough coverage in terms of elementals and some physical spell to toss around, that spell is mainly needed for two fights anyway, but it you go Evil Shaman you pretty much need it in order for her debuffs to work on enemies that are resistant to Demon Breath/Ghost Road, in that case get Anti-Magic.

Good call in pointing this out; it slipped my mind that Demon Breath has three elements. I do like that Evil Shaman gets access to Black Curse through a class change item, so this still might be the way to go.

33 minutes ago, smileless said:

Better play save and cover as many of the important buffs/debuffs, you have a caster heavy team so things like mind up, def up (or magic shield) and speed up are needed for their damage.

Good advice here.... Speed Up is not available here in any configuration, and Sage only gets Mind Up; however, casting a saber on enemies to reduce physical damage through elemental resistance can be an alternative, so I wouldn't rule this team out. Magic Shield should be quite a good spell for this team, but Fenrir Knight's final weapon can cover at least the MP regeneration part and keep HP up as well. Cast speed and elemental access are real issues, though, and Team 1) beats this team on both in any configuration.

Edited May 19, 2021 by rpschamp

[rpschamp 0]

It's also interesting that Evil Shaman should not need to trade Ghost for Ghost Road in 2.0 if she fills her spell slots before reaching 20 INT, making her more boss-oriented (especially in Lise's final dungeon); with Saint Saber resistance, the group Power Down might not be as necessary....

Edited May 19, 2021 by rpschamp

[Nesouk 49]

1 hour ago, rpschamp said:

Good discussions here! I'm running Lise, Angela, Carlie and I have a couple of ideas for final teams to bounce off the board:

1) Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Necromancer/Evil Shaman: Light Lise and Dark Carlie both get natural Light Resistance, so Star Lancer can cast Saint Saber on enemies to minimize physical damage if Angela wears an elemental resistance armor or accessory. Star Lancer and Grand Divina can cover all the buffs, and Necromancer or Evil Shaman can cover debuffs, depending if you want Black Curse or the group-targeted Ghost Road and Demon Breath. Evil Shaman may work better if Grand Divina goes for her VIT capstone as the Necromancer's final weapon might not be of much use. I like Lise with her INT capstone here: she could use Evil Shaman's final weapon for -1/4 boss HP as Nesouk pointed out (and I guess Lunatic subtracts another 20%?), or she could use Grand Divina's final weapon to cover 2-3 extra sabers (Evil Shaman can cover Protect Up) and free up Grand Divina's weapon slot, which would be especially nice if Grand Divina goes for her LUC capstone instead. Evil Shaman would also bring Anti-Magic, though I'm not sure how useful it would be on this team. Carlie could take Regeneration to help out with the healing and Lise could take Resistance.

2) Dragon Master/Fenrir Knight, Magus/Rune Master, Bishop/Sage: Dark Angela and Light Carlie both get natural Fire Resistance, so Angela or Carlie can cast Fire Saber on enemies to minimize physical damange if Lise wears an elemental resistance armor or accessory. The choice of final classes is tricky here. Fenrir Knight and Bishop/Sage would be a great team for HP/MP healing, but if I went with Bishop, Dragon Master's Enhanced Anti-Magic would help out with the elemental spell damage. Magus or Sage would be the preferable Curse casters to Fenrir Knight as Dark Force is much more efficient than Black Rain. I am tempted to choose Sage to free up Lise and Angela to go Fenrir Knight and Rune Master, but then the buffs would be quite limited, and the sabers spells wouldn't work out as well. There is some optimal configuration here that promises a ton of power, but it doesn't seem as straightforward as the first team. Rune Master would be a lot of fun: I've always wanted to try casting Petrify or Snowman on Lise with a status protection accessory and Thorn Armor (or Curse) off-screen and then let her go forward with a shield and reflect enemies into oblivion.

Let me know what you think....

Team 1 : About Evil Shaman's Final Weapon and Lunatic they all stack multiplicaly, meaning if you have Evil Shaman's Final Weapon it goes like this :

100% x 0.875 x 0.875 = 76,5625%

Then you add Lunatic :

76,5625 x 0.8 = 61,25%

Essentially you removed 38,75% of the ennemies HP just like that so this is actually over a 1/3 of the ennemies HP ^^.

That being said 2 tempting idea with Necromancer :

-The Auto-Debuff set by equipping her with Auto-Buff, Quick Cast and 2 Magic Up, having her Black Curse means ennemies will get fully debuffs as soon as they spawn, so you won't need to cast Black Curse with Carlie unless the ennemies buff themselves.

-The Invert Buff armor with Black Curse would let her set all buff at once, you are then free to go for Dark Class on Lise.

Necromancer also cover more element than Evil Shaman and I think would work better as an offensive caster.

While Dark Lise is great for a caster party there is one inconvenience with Dragon Master however, no matter how you look at it you can't get both Power Down and Mind Down with Dragon Master this is certainly to balance with the fact of her Srengthen Anti-Magic, but if you are planning for Dragon Master you are going to need someone with the missing debuff, as such going Archmage on Angela and Bishop on Carlie, covering both defensive buff with Magic Shield and getting the missing debuff for Angela might be a better solution, tough going Magus with Invert Armor, get Mind Down with Lise and Power Up with Magus (as I don't think Magus's Self Mind Up can be cast on ennemies even with Meta Multi). However Fenrir Knight doesn't have that issue and can get all Debuff MT without to much issue so probably the easiest option.

 

[smileless 0]

Auto Buff Armor/Auto Debuff set are so convenient for mob fights, I think most set ups should probably aim for that especially if you play on harder difficulties.

Edited May 19, 2021 by smileless

[Nesouk 49]

21 hours ago, smileless said:

Limited in options when it comes to Duran,  Kevin, Angela (as far as I can tell) without having to sacrifice either speed up or speed down, spells like that, it all comes mainly to the party similar to the previous job thread that I tried but updated with 2.0+ changes

Duran - Lord
Skip Power Up, Energy Ball or Analyze doesn't matter much
Honestly main build might just give him a PIE weapon, max his PIE stat and just have him heal as he buffs/debuffs in between
AGI or PIE capstone

Kevin - God Hand
Skip Triple Spell, Life Booster
AGI or LUK capstone so maybe a crit build for him

Angela - Archmage
Skip Rainbow Dust, Aura Wave
Capstone: AGI (party casts faster) or INT (pierce 35 m.def)

Actually the Randomizer give me Duran, Kevin and Angela with Paladin, Death Hand and Archmage, I actually think this can work to as such :

Kevin as Death Hand

Spells :
1-Flame Saber (LV40)
2-Diamond Saber^ (LV44)
3-Speed Up* (LV46)
4-Dark Saber* (LV50)
5-Body Change* (LV51)
6-Thunder Jutsu (LV55)
7-Aura Wave (LV60)
8-Lunatic (LV65)
9-Rockfall (LV67)
10-Leaf Saber (LV70)

INT Capstone : sword magic +atk gives 20% instead of 10% (party)

Gear :

Weapon : LV3 Armor Break
Helm : LV2/3 Tech Up
Armor : ???
Ring 1 : Tech Gain Up
Ring 2 : Trials Skills

Angela as Arch Mage 

Spells :
1-Saint Beam* (LV40)
2-Dark Force* (LV41)
3-Mind Down (LV43)
4-Power Down (LV44)
5-Earthquake* (LV45)
6-Thunderstorm* (LV46)
7-Mega Splash* (LV47)
8-Explode* (LV48)
9-Anti Magic (LV50)
10-Rainbow Dust (LV53)

Raise AGL to 22 (LV55)

AGL Capstone : party casts 20% faster

Gear :
Weapon : ExploitWeakness/Magic Up
Gear : Magic Up
Armor : MP Regen Up
Ring 1 : Meta Curse
Ring 2 : Vary

Duran as Paladin :

Spells :
1-Magic Shield (LV39)
2-Saint Saber (LV42)
3-Protect Up* (LV45)
4-Holy Ball (LV47)
5-Heal Light* (LV51)
6-Exorcise (LV55) 
Raise PIE to 25 at LV56
7-Diamond Missile (LV57)
8-Tinkle Rain (LV58)
9-Ice Smash (LV62)
10-Speed Up* (LV65)

PIE Capstone : +10 MP Max

Weapon : Heal Up
Helm : Constant Regen (Curse)
Armor : MP Regen Plus/Life Saver
Ring 1 : Shield
Ring 2 : Heal Up

So this team has :

-Every buff except Power Up and offensive side of Mind Up
-Every Debuff except Speed Down (Protect Down achieve with Death Hand's Thunder Jutsu), and beyond that has Death Hand's Final Weapon for reducing the Physical and Magic Defense even further.
-4 out of 6 Elemental Sabers only Ice Saber and Thunder Saber with Kevin's INT capstone to stregthen these buffs
-Exorcise to deal with Undead ennemies very easily
-Spell for all element with Anti Magic and non elemental spell as well as physical damage

Going tech build with Death Hand for Defenses debuff, support with Paladin with occasionnal offensive spell and debuff with Angela before spell casting.

[Nesouk 49]

3 minutes ago, smileless said:

Auto Buff Armor/Auto Debuff set are so convenient for mob fights, I think most set ups should probably aim for that especially if you play on harder difficulties.

Well it has it's downside especially with Carlie, Auto-Buff has the lowest HP Multiplier out of all the armor in the game, with pretty low defenses overall, so for Carlie you'd have to make up for it, Lise a lot more tanky and easier to build around this armor. And Auto-Debuff is a full set so it require all slot to be taken.

[rpschamp 0]

2 hours ago, Nesouk said:

-The Invert Buff armor with Black Curse would let her set all buff at once, you are then free to go for Dark Class on Lise.

I was thinking about this to free up Lise to go for Fenrir Knight, if only for her final weapon. Fenrir Knight could also invert instead if you prefer a better armor on Carlie. Comparing these two teams:

1) Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Evil Shaman/Necromancer
- Lise can function as an alternative Saber caster (up to five elements with Grand Divina's final weapon)
- Easy path to Saint Saber resistance
- MP recovery through accessories
- Silence
- No need to use Invert Armor

3) Fenrir Knight, Grand Divina, Necromancer
- MP recovery through counters (might not be as reliable)
- No easy path to saber resistance
- Need to use Invert Armor

Though in general I prefer Fenrir Knight to Star Lancer (fun final weapon, better colors, awesome subscreen pose), I think Team 1 still comes out ahead.

2 hours ago, Nesouk said:

Necromancer also cover more element than Evil Shaman and I think would work better as an offensive caster.

This one is debatable; Necromancer gets access to one more pure element of spell damage, as well as non-elemental spells (which is nice), but Evil Shaman still gets access to five of the six (plus Demon Breath), and with two of her final weapons in play and Lunatic for bosses, a smaller portion of the enemy's HP is in play, and the whole team benefits in terms of needing to reach an smaller goal. I think the major benefit of Necromancer here is Black Curse, or maybe some low HP strategy to keep the extra damage from her final weapon high. But I admit that the best choice is not very clear.

Edited May 19, 2021 by rpschamp

[Nesouk 49]

Well there is a lot to take into account.

Like that 2 Evil Shaman weapon is only possible with Lise's INT capstone and dedicating her Weapon slot to it (not happening with her Dark Classes both Dragon Master and Fenrir Knight's Final Weapon are just not worth sacrificing for that) so that already require 2 specific character, otherwise the Difference between Lunatic and ES's Final Weapon + Lunatic is only 10%, also Lise isn't necessarly the best suited for offensive so removing for a more offensive character.
Also Evil Shaman is pretty much lock into her Final Weapon, while outside of her Final Weapon Necromancer can also use Magic Up weapon, Magitech or whatever you want she has more flexibility in that aspect (heck can even give her the AGL Weapon and make her a decent melee fighter). Another disadvantage for Evil Shaman is that for a lot of boss in order to inflict her Debuff she first need to cast Anti Magic and then her 2 spells, while Black Curse doesn't require Anti Magic and inflict all in one spells, which allow Necromancer to go faster on the offensive, and Necromancer has Dark Spell for Curse upgrade.

But yes if you have Lise and is ready to give her INT capstone and ES final weapon, Evil Shaman is 100% worth it, the 10% Max HP bonus is also good if you have powerfull attacker besides her, having both Power Down, Mind Down, Protect Up, Antimagic and Max HP reduction on one character is also pretty convenient no denying that.

41 minutes ago, rpschamp said:

1) Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Evil Shaman/Necromancer
- Lise can function as an alternative Saber caster (up to five elements with Grand Divina's final weapon)
- Easy path to Saint Saber resistance
- MP recovery through accessories
- Silence
- No need to use Invert Armor

3) Fenrir Knight, Grand Divina, Necromancer
- MP recovery through counters (might not be as reliable)
- No easy path to saber resistance
- Need to use Invert Armor

Though in general I prefer Fenrir Knight to Star Lancer (fun final weapon, better colors, awesome subscreen pose), I think Team 1 still comes out ahead.

 

For MP recovery don't forget Fenrir Knight can also learn Leaf Saber, also don't exclude the fact Fenrir Knight recover ALL the MP of the entire team in one counter as well as healing 25% of HP for the entire team, landing Counter do take some practice but once you do this is definitly a great recovery option in Fenrir Knight's favor, also in both case Lise can act as the tank with Shield and Life Saver Armor.

You could also go for Bishop instead of Necromancer use Magic Shield to buff your defenses and get the Saber Resisting strat with Saint Saber or Thunder Saber as a bonus getting also Power Up for Fenrir Knight.

[rpschamp 0]

39 minutes ago, Nesouk said:

For MP recovery don't forget Fenrir Knight can also learn Leaf Saber, also don't exclude the fact Fenrir Knight recover ALL the MP of the entire team in one counter as well as healing 25% of HP for the entire team, landing Counter do take some practice but once you do this is definitly a great recovery option in Fenrir Knight's favor, also in both case Lise can act as the tank with Shield and Life Saver Armor.

You could also go for Bishop instead of Necromancer use Magic Shield to buff your defenses and get the Saber Resisting strat with Saint Saber or Thunder Saber as a bonus getting also Power Up for Fenrir Knight.

I think Dark Angela would do better than Grand Divina here. I've always been tempted to put Fenrir Knight on the same team as Dark Angela or Dark Carlie to take advantage of the MP recovery, which was the purpose of Team 2 described above: Fenrir Knight, Magus/Rune Master, Bishop/Sage.

Two options:

2a) Fenrir Knight, Magus, Bishop: No Speed Up, but pretty much everything else. Almighty Magic armor on Magus to cast Annihilator every time Lise lands a counter seems like a reasonably viable strategy against bosses, but kind of one-note. Bishop would provide easy Flame Saber resistance, and Angela has an easy path to her AGI capstone to make up for the lack of Speed Up.

2b) Fenrir Knight, Rune Master, Sage: Weak on buffs, but Mind Up is the most important buff, Life Booster can help for bosses, and I'm not sure that you need all three of Protect up, Power Down, and Saber resistance; most players just use the first two, while it seems that either of the first two combined with Saber resistance should have a greater benefit to physical defense. Plus, Sage has Dark Force which frees Angela to go Rune Master, which just seems like an all-around more useful class for regular enemies (MT Snowman, MT Silence, picking enemies off with Stone Cloud) and bosses (Level 3 elemental damage for less MP; Level 2 damage that bypasses resistance/immunity when necessary). You would be missing Speed Up.... And Magus definitely has an easier path to her AGI capstone if you want to collect all of the Rune Master's Level 3 spells. But I may be tempted to stick that Constant Regeneration helmet on Rune Master so her cast-time isn't wasted.

[Nesouk 49]

One thing I'm tempted with Rune Master is run her with the full Trials Set, she might not get benefit from the armor, but reducing casttime to minimum with her LV3 Spells and Final Weapon is pretty tempting, and the rest of the set will still make her immune to Crit, remove her weakness and death score and increase her defenses. When her Final Weapon isn't needed the Magitec weapon could also work, as for capstone her PIE capstone could work, since all her 4 slot would be curse that would be a +80HP and +28 in both defenses.

[rpschamp 0]

1 hour ago, Nesouk said:

One thing I'm tempted with Rune Master is run her with the full Trials Set, she might not get benefit from the armor, but reducing casttime to minimum with her LV3 Spells and Final Weapon is pretty tempting, and the rest of the set will still make her immune to Crit, remove her weakness and death score and increase her defenses. When her Final Weapon isn't needed the Magitec weapon could also work, as for capstone her PIE capstone could work, since all her 4 slot would be curse that would be a +80HP and +28 in both defenses.

This is a great idea, and perfect to pair with Fenrir Knight. I'm a little concerned about Trials Defense's "no defense vs. Level 2/3 techs".... but definitely worth a try if I choose this path.

[smileless 0]

12 hours ago, Nesouk said:

Actually the Randomizer give me Duran, Kevin and Angela with Paladin, Death Hand and Archmage, I actually think this can work to as such :

Kevin as Death Hand

Spells :
1-Flame Saber (LV40)
2-Diamond Saber^ (LV44)
3-Speed Up* (LV46)
4-Dark Saber* (LV50)
5-Body Change* (LV51)
6-Thunder Jutsu (LV55)
7-Aura Wave (LV60)
8-Lunatic (LV65)
9-Rockfall (LV67)
10-Leaf Saber (LV70)

INT Capstone : sword magic +atk gives 20% instead of 10% (party)

Gear :

Weapon : LV3 Armor Break
Helm : LV2/3 Tech Up
Armor : ???
Ring 1 : Tech Gain Up
Ring 2 : Trials Skills

Angela as Arch Mage 

Spells :
1-Saint Beam* (LV40)
2-Dark Force* (LV41)
3-Mind Down (LV43)
4-Power Down (LV44)
5-Earthquake* (LV45)
6-Thunderstorm* (LV46)
7-Mega Splash* (LV47)
8-Explode* (LV48)
9-Anti Magic (LV50)
10-Rainbow Dust (LV53)

Raise AGL to 22 (LV55)

AGL Capstone : party casts 20% faster

Gear :
Weapon : ExploitWeakness/Magic Up
Gear : Magic Up
Armor : MP Regen Up
Ring 1 : Meta Curse
Ring 2 : Vary

Duran as Paladin :

Spells :
1-Magic Shield (LV39)
2-Saint Saber (LV42)
3-Protect Up* (LV45)
4-Holy Ball (LV47)
5-Heal Light* (LV51)
6-Exorcise (LV55) 
Raise PIE to 25 at LV56
7-Diamond Missile (LV57)
8-Tinkle Rain (LV58)
9-Ice Smash (LV62)
10-Speed Up* (LV65)

PIE Capstone : +10 MP Max

Weapon : Heal Up
Helm : Constant Regen (Curse)
Armor : MP Regen Plus/Life Saver
Ring 1 : Shield
Ring 2 : Heal Up

So this team has :

-Every buff except Power Up and offensive side of Mind Up
-Every Debuff except Speed Down (Protect Down achieve with Death Hand's Thunder Jutsu), and beyond that has Death Hand's Final Weapon for reducing the Physical and Magic Defense even further.
-4 out of 6 Elemental Sabers only Ice Saber and Thunder Saber with Kevin's INT capstone to stregthen these buffs
-Exorcise to deal with Undead ennemies very easily
-Spell for all element with Anti Magic and non elemental spell as well as physical damage

Going tech build with Death Hand for Defenses debuff, support with Paladin with occasionnal offensive spell and debuff with Angela before spell casting.

This looks very good and well planned also. Both Death Hand and Paladin have Speed Up, maybe skip Paladin's Speed Up instead for another spell? Tho from what I can see it learns only single target Sleep Flower so maybe having another Speed Up user is better than just learning single target sleep flower.

Edited May 20, 2021 by smileless

[Nesouk 49]

29 minutes ago, rpschamp said:

This is a great idea, and perfect to pair with Fenrir Knight. I'm a little concerned about Trials Defense's "no defense vs. Level 2/3 techs".... but definitely worth a try if I choose this path.

According to Praetarius even with that helm on Hard, you'll still take less damage from tech than Vanilla, so probably not that bad, especially if one play on Normal or lower.

[rpschamp 0]

On 5/20/2021 at 3:19 AM, Nesouk said:

According to Praetarius even with that helm on Hard, you'll still take less damage from tech than Vanilla, so probably not that bad, especially if one play on Normal or lower.

So, to take this further.... Rune Master will learn everything but Thunder Saber and Flame Saber, giving her all four Level 3 elemental spells, Fenrir Knight will learn everything but Transshape and Poison Bubble, learning all the MT debuffs and Moon and Leaf Saber, which will be great for Rune Master, and Carlie.... here, I think Light Carlie would be best for MT Heal Light and Sabers to enhance Angela. Bishop offers Magic Shield, the two remaining basic elemental Sabers, Power Up which works well with Trials Buff, an easy spot for Resistance (still important for Lise and Carlie), and Saint Saber to power her own spells, while Sage offers the missing Dark element and Curse, Mind Up, Life Booster, Leaf Saber to let Fenrir Knight learn Resistance, one of the two remaining basic elemental Sabers, and a final weapon which I believe ticks HP regeneration even through spell animation, something this team will be seeing a lot of. Again, I think I'm leaning towards Sage.

Capstones? Lise's AGI would help with Fenrir Knight's counter, and Carlie's LUK would help with keeping MP up between counters. Angela should probably go for PIE due to her cursed equipment, but VIT and INT look strong as well.

One of the obvious benefits here is that the Trials set helps with this team's lack of Speed Up, so as long as I master Fenrir Knight's counter, this team should be a monster. Now, this looks like a team that can compete with Star Lancer, Grand Divina, Evil Shaman/Necromancer. Let me know if you have any more ideas!

Edited May 21, 2021 by rpschamp

[smileless 0]

On 18/05/2021 at 8:31 PM, Nesouk said:

Also Hawk's PIE capstone could be an alternative for increasing Carlie's spell damage without Mind Up, all you need is to equip the accessory that give regular attack the Element you want to get as Sabers and throw his LV2 Tech to turn it into a proper Saber effects (so giving it the +10% attack and boosting spells of corresponding element) and extend it to the entire party.

A question on this to be sure, in order for that to work do those accessories need to be equiped on Hawk or it doesn't matter who equips them?

[Nesouk 49]

Hawk need to have the ring or Saber himself.

[smileless 0]

Take 2 doing it more organized Nesouk's style after more carefully looking at equipment:

 

Spoiler

Carlie (main) - Necromancer
Spells - no order:
Holy Ball*, Tinkle Rain, Unicorn Head, Machine Golem, Ghost, Ghoul, Black Curse, Dark Saber, Gremlin, Black Rain
Skip Great Demon and Half Vanish

LUK capstone - spells cost less MP

Weapon: Magic Up/Spell Revenge
Helm: Quick Cast
Armor: MP Reg/Life Saver Armor/other needs
Ring 1: Magic Up
Ring 2: Blood Magic/varies

Duran - Paladin
Spells - no order:
Diamond Missile, Sleep Flower, Holy Ball, Heal Light*, Exorcise, Magic Shield, Saint Saber, Tinkle Rain, Ice Smash, Speed Up
Skip Anti-Magic (Wanderer cover that) and Protect Up (you have two Magic Shield users)

PIE capstone: + 10 maxMP

Weapon: Heal Up
Helm: Constant Regen (curse)
Armor: MP Reg.
Ring 1: Shield
Ring 2: Heal Up/varies

Hawk - Wanderer
Spells - no order:
Arrows, Sleep Flower*, Body Change*, Poison Bubble, Lunatic, Anti-Magic,Transshape, Life Booster, Half Vanish, Magic Shield
Skip Energy Ball, Aura Wave

PIE capstone - using a Lv2/3 tech spreads current saber element to the party and makes pseudo saber real unless resisted

Weapon: Half Vanish+/TP up (unsure)
Helm: Quick Cast/varies
Armor: MP Reg
Ring 1: TP Regeneration
Ring 2: saber element accesory/varies
 

In terms of equipment Hawk, as the ultimate support for most part will probably aim to regain MP fast as well as quick cast (while gain some TP as he supports with his spells), Quick Cast helm is questionable as party has speed up and speed down, it will probably vary most of the time. I might also go for Meta Curse ring for Carlie.

Thinking maybe I should skip Paladin's Sleep Flower and teach Regeneration with the cursed ring instead, but I think I will probably just equip remove weakness helm or armor equipment when necessary. I think I am now set for the next run.

Edited May 20, 2021 by smileless